MSN Virtual Earth Team - Virtual Earth Ships
- Posted: Jul 24, 2005 at 9:01 PM
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A couple of months ago
we interviewed the Virtual Earth team and got an early look at what they were planning. They have now gone live so we went back and interviewed the team again. They jumped right into a demo and talked about some hot secret features: locate me and a developer
SDK.
Want more?
Visit the Virtual Earth site at http://virtualearth.msn.com ( http://www.virtualearth.com should also work) to give it a test drive.
To see how Dare Obasanjo built a lookup for movies in your neighborhood, check out his Movie Finder site that is built using Virtual Earth.
Check out Chandu's blog who is from the Virtual Earth Team. I bet he'll have even more to share.
Pictured here is Steve Lombardi, program manager, Matthew Cheung, and Cody Ebberson (runs the developer program). The team is keeping a blog on MSN Spaces where they are responding to complaints and praise and giving even more tips.
Oh, and the "ViaVirtualEarth" site will have links to lots of developer information, among other info.
Want more?
Visit the Virtual Earth site at http://virtualearth.msn.com ( http://www.virtualearth.com should also work) to give it a test drive.
To see how Dare Obasanjo built a lookup for movies in your neighborhood, check out his Movie Finder site that is built using Virtual Earth.
Check out Chandu's blog who is from the Virtual Earth Team. I bet he'll have even more to share.
Pictured here is Steve Lombardi, program manager, Matthew Cheung, and Cody Ebberson (runs the developer program). The team is keeping a blog on MSN Spaces where they are responding to complaints and praise and giving even more tips.
Oh, and the "ViaVirtualEarth" site will have links to lots of developer information, among other info.
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and they shoot off a bunch of model rockets
The team is also watching a variety of blog search engines. So, if you say it sucks here (or praise it, we like those too!), or on your blog, the team will see it!
"another channel9 video that makes me realize how much I don't like Minnesota and my job"
Great job Virtual Earth team. I am very excited to see this go online.
I was very impressed with Steven's explanation of the "Locate me" feature. He explained it very well and this feature has got me hooked.
At first I was a little iffy on Virtual Earth because of some of the features Google Earth has such as the 3D stuff. But after thinking about it, I don't use the 3D stuff that often.
Why would I need to see where I'm going in 3D if all I want to do is find a route to take or find out where I am? Its not like I'm flying or hovering or anything.
Another thing I like about Virtual Earth right from the start is the fact its web-based. Google Earth is a downloadble program. And even with Google Earth being a downloadable program, I had to wait for things to render (or turn that feature of) or maps to download. I like Virtual Earth being web-based alot more. And when it was online for a short time last night, Virtual Earth was FAST! Very sharp.
Nice job guys!
- Brandon
MSTechToday.com
Better video would be nice Scoble, but mac users are not on your high priority list since you have been getting spanked by them on your blog.
Better video would be nice Scoble, but mac users are not on your high priority list since you have been getting spanked by them on your blog.
1 hour late so far.
I remember when I first saw maps.google.com, it was up, running and responsive. C'mon!
I feel like I am in Jurasic Park??? We are on the ride but all the Dino's are no shows.....I hope Virtual Earth doesn't want to find us mac (and windows) users and eat us........
I know everyone is eager to check it out, but just hang in there until the time we said it would be going live.
And Scoble told us all it would be live by the time we finished watching the video.
Virtual Earth is now live! Hope you have as much fun playing with it as we had building it.
Great job overall with Virtual Earth, but here are a few Firefox bugs I found:
- Scroll wheel issue when zooming out. I can zoom in just fine with my scroll wheel in Firefox, but often when I zoom out with the wheel the map also pans south and eventually gets stuck.
- Zoom slider and directional pad often get "stuck" and require an extra click in order to stop zoom or scrolling, respectively.
- Minor: The bounding box for the X on windows such as the welcome panel is a bit larger than it should be.
- Very Minor: No transparency on the top blue banner.
It'd be nice if these issues could be corrected.
Scroll wheel doesn't work on Mac????
Oh never mind - one botton mouse - my bad
(scoble we don't take ourselves too serious)
I tried the blogit feature and got this message when directed to link:
http://spaces.msn.com/members/virtualearthsucks/
World trade centre...
http://virtualearth.msn.com/default.aspx?cp=40.711887|-74.011859&style=h&lvl=16&v=1
Following the "Drive To" and "Drive From" links takes me to the same old MSN Maps & Directions, cluttered with ads and loads of extraneous information, and lacking all of the cool new VE features!
Bugs after playing around for 2.5 minutes:
Many of my searches seem to be timing out... the location window just says "Loading..." indefinitely, with no status updates if a timeout occurs.
VE seems to be having some issues finding locations that Google Maps finds without any problems, like "magnolia & tujunga, north hollywood ca".
Search for "4th & pike, seattle wa", text in the scratch pad replaces '&' with '& a m p ;'
Anyhow, cool app, and congrats on the launch! I'm sure you'll work out all the kinks with time.
This is pretty cool stuff. It's a pity there's no street level aerial photos and road map for other countries yet.
It would be really cool that when you use the blog it feature apart from giving you the link it would also appear an image of the map.
Keep the good job!
Awesome stuff
Have installed the Microsoft Location Finder...
1. When I right click location finder in the notification area and select help, the Microsoft Location Finder Help file, are placed right over the current window in IE, forcing users to use the back button.
It would be more practical to open a new window for the help file.
2. The auto run feature (automatically run location finder when I log on to windows), are located under the settings option.
I think it would be easier if you just placed an auto run menu item that the user could check/uncheck
Awesome Aerial Photography and cool features, but I think a name change to Virtual USA would be more appropriate. Coming from Australia, this thing is pretty much useless to me, just as KeyHole was: "Cool Novelty" but not useful.
Don't even seem to have London covered?
And the "Where" search, doesn't even believe that cities outside of the US even exist? Let alone show a map of them... Very disappointing
Is there no way to get directions within virtual earth?
If you click the directions to/from link, it takes you to maps.msn.com
It would be nice if eventually the directions were directly in virtual earth instead of having to use an external application. Just a thought.
Also it is still running quite slow
I would however say although Google has less photographic detail in regards to total u.s. satellite coverage, the content they do have is better in that it is more recent than the virtual earth pictures, which I assume are circa 2000 or older (WTC is still standing in NYC). Google has circa 2003-04 from what I can tell and is more valuable in this case. No doubt MS will update their photo data... I only hope it will happen sooner rather than later, otherwise this product will be 2nd best, rather than the best.
Take care,
Rob
Other than that, Google maps has a much nicer feel to it.
That is pretty cool, I would have to agree, I still like google's version, however, I also noted this is still a beta...
Anyhow one thing that would be cool, if it is possible, would be when I use the scroll wheel, it will zoom in/out on the area I am hovering over.
They are responding to the feedback as it comes in.
And although the searches may be 'more accurate' like in the buca example, it seems for general terms, there is a lot of filtering and it is hard to find things.
Example: Pet Groomer in Renton, WA
http://maps.google.com/maps?q=Pet+Groomer&ll=47.483105,-122.216377&spn=0.148122,0.286039&t=k&near=Renton,+WA&num=10&start=0&hl=en
http://virtualearth.msn.com/default.aspx?ss=Pet%20Groomers&cp=47.475281|-122.205015&style=r&lvl=12&sp=adr.17821%20152nd%20Pl%20SE%2C%20Renton%2C%20WA%2098058&v=1
I tried a few other general terms and seemed to reach the same results.
I'm kind of glad you didn't waste time with driving directions in 1.0. I think the google driving directions are weak. The tech is cool, but actually printing and then following is ugly and I still use yahoo maps for that (although I do use the maps to print out a nice big view of my endpoint so that I do not get lost on the little streets) Plus, it never remembers anything (scratch pad is cool) and the highlights do not print.
Nice work for a first revision though! After you fix the tiling issues which seem to be there today (probably due to load), I can see myself starting to use this tool since you seemed to look at google, addressed the shortcomings, and rolled out a more useful product.
http://virtualearth.msn.com/default.aspx?cp=40.153947|-76.725378&style=h&lvl=16&v=1
Three mile island looks better in MSN than it does in google. Always wanted to see it without going there...
Sorry, but aside from looking at old satellite pictures of my house, I'm not sure what much I can do with this.
I missed the post where anybody said MS shouldn't compete, or that it was illegal for them to do so. (or that competition is bad for consumers)
It says ALERT: Malicious script detected.
Object - windows Script Host shell Object
Activity - Run
Your computer is halted and needs to do someting about this script:
File - MsiExe.exe
I've never seen Norton 2003 do anything like this. It's usually pretty smart at figuring out what's malicious and what isn't.
BTW: I just wanted to test it out even though
I know it's not gonna work because I'm not even in the US. The IP locate thing at least finds where the ISP is located.
I tried that too. I clicked allow script and it worked fine... fine as in it worked, I don't live anywhere near Minnesota.
ditto. I use google maps frequently for directions. I guess some of this is cool but I fail to see how it is useful for me.
How can you say the USEability is better than google maps when you point out it doesn't do driving directions. Again, can we finding directions is one of the main USEs of mapping software (if not the MAIN use)???
Early days yet, but I am in the UK and Google Earth looks to have better support for us at the moment.
Take the Kodak EasyShare One, it has Wi-Fi capabilities, using the co-ordinates much the same as Virtual Earth does the camera could then insert the street location into the pictures meta-data. Thus a cheap way to get GPS like functionality into mainstream consumer cameras and digital phones alike!!
On top of that if Virtual Earth is intergrated into Windows Vista properly and if the meta-data of the picture contained the co-ordinates, then when the pictures are transferred onto computer (wirelessly of course) an Eagle Eye 45deg view of the exact location of the picture could be shown side by side the image bringing up a whole plethera of new and potential interactivity with your images.
**That sounds entirely do-able and I would expect functionality something very similar to this in the comming version of Windows**
Horrible idea. A webapp like this shouldn't be intagrated into any OS, that's the point of webapps, they're integrated in browsers (ideally using well defined standards). Webapp to OS integration features are gimmicks, not great design ideas.
Right, I agree with you that Google went on a innovation spree while MS/Yahoo thought no one could compete them.
Competition is mother of all innovation (i think i guess to some extent),
It thrives you to innovate and make your presence to the user.
I would say in some areas MS still beats the rest.
MSVE is pretty good but still needs work. Here's something funny I dont know its my browser problem or something. I use Firefox for everything and to compare i use IE so I tried MSVE in FF its slow very slow(I dont know why) I tried this on T1 line. I did some searches near my area(NY) and it took a loooong time to display the list of names near my area.
Some aerial images are old very old compared to Google.
Also its very annoying window when i search for something and it displays 5-10 places and i move my mouse a big window displays its annoying it will nice to display the window *Only* when i want click on it.
Zoom In/out is cool. adding driving directions will nice with interactive tour..
I use MS S&T 2005 I wish if something like this can be added to MS S&T 2006.
I will add more of my comments if MSVE Team like.
Arun
That looks completely ugly. If the user layout for pictures, and non available pictures could be fixed, that'd be nice!
Here's a few things I noticed:
- The mouse-wheel support in FF is funky, but that's understandable since there's no "onmousewheel" event in FF. I'm pretty sure they faked it using the "onscroll" event or something and for that it works really well.
- I have no idea why they're using greyscale images on some parts of the map. Even if it was difficult to obtain color photos, this is something people will definitely complain about, especially since google maps is all color. The "colorized" black & whites images look quite ridiculous.
- The Road map/Aerial photo links are easy to overlook.
- The "what and where" search, in my opinion is too complicated. It would be much easier and more user friendly if you could do searches like "Italian restaurant in Chicago" using a single input box.
- The labels on the aerial photos are excellent.
- The resolution of some of the aerial photos is stunning.
I think it's taken Microsoft a while to fully understand the potential of AJAX (which Microsoft technically invented), but with stuff like VE or Start.com, I think they're on the right track.
Great job.
------------
Rather than posting my opinion of MSN VE based solely on first impressions, I thought I'd get a little more familiar with it first, and now that I have, my reactions are mixed. Let's take it step by step...
General UI:
I personally think Virtual Earth wins in this area, although some may think otherwise. The ability to zoom in and out using the scrollwheel (or the touchpad edge) makes navigation just so much more natural as compared to using a separate slider control, and it's less jerky than Google's implementation. The "game panning" navigation, which kicks in if you use the compass-like UI element is also very smooth. MSN VE and Google Maps are tied when it comes to keyboard navigation though - the implementations are almost identical, although as mentioned earlier, zooming in and out using the + and - keys is smoother with VE.
Roadmaps:
There's no real comparison I can make in this area, other than to say MSN VE's color scheme is a little more subdued as compared to Google's brighter colors. Which one you prefer is largely a matter of personal preference. To me, the difference is small enough to make it insignificant.
Satellite imagery:
Ah, this seems to be a sort of hit-and-miss thing, where one does better than the other depending on your location. I found that here in the California region, MSN VE's satellite imagery is significantly better than Google's. The level to which you can zoom in is nothing short of impressive! VE uses the same imagery as TerraServer, which I've used before, so this didn't come as a surprise to me. However, when I jumped over to the New York area, the result was disappointing. Google offers full color satellite imagery here, whereas MSN VE only has grayscale images available, which aren't quite as clear either. Some people have also noticed that MSN's images might be older than the ones Google has acquired. The MSN VE team has announced that it is working towards acquiring updated images. All I can say here is that depending on your location, your mileage may vary, and vary quite a bit it may. =)
Layering and the Scratchpad:
Props to the MSN VE team for both of these unique features. They're extremely convenient for local search applications. I always found it a little irritating when my previous search results on Google Maps were wiped off the map when I searched for something else. MSN VE uses a layered approach, whereby it allows you to perform multiple local searches one after another and displays the results on the map using different colored flags. So if you're travelling, and looking for your hotel, and also want to find any chinese restaurants nearby, it becomes really convenient. The scratchpad allows you to add multiple locations to it, which is a handy tool to have if you're going on a trip and want to keep track of all the different stops you're going to make on the map, in addition to the starting point and destination. If I need to do local searches from now on, I know where I'll be going.
Locate Me:
This is another very unique feature originally developed at Microsoft Research that uses WiFi triangulation to determine your location on the map. It seemed to work really well in the Channel9 video, but for some reason, VE used the IP reverse-lookup method to find my location even though I had the little Location Finder app installed and running. So the best that it could do was to tell me I was in Los Angeles. Not bad, but nothing earth-shattering. Maybe there weren't enough wireless access points around me? This can end up being a really cool feature once it starts to work for everybody though.
The disappointment:
And this is the big one...really big. Big enough that I couldn't believe it when I first tried it. MSN VE has no driving directions! How could this not be the top priority? The single most important reason people using online mapping services is to find driving directions. Without that, everything else just becomes a novelty that will wear out sooner or later. From what I can tell, the base is there - anything that you search for has "Drive from" and "Drive to" links associated with it. The problem is that clicking either of these links, rather than overlaying directions on the existing map, takes you over to the old MSN Maps site, where the user experience is just sub-par. The banner ads on MSN Maps take up more space than the map itself! This is a real shame for an otherwise wondeful implementation. If anyone on the MSN VE team is reading this (and I heard they're looking for feedback on blogs), I really urge you to make this your number one priority for the Fall refresh! "Eagle-eye" view is incredibly cool, and it's something I know everyone is waiting for, but this is a far more useful addition that really needs attention.
To sum it all up, I feel that the lack of driving directions on MSN VE is enough to prevent me from moving away from Google Maps for now. I'll still start using VE for local searches though, since the implementation is just so much nicer. However, I see the amazing potential that VE has, and once driving directions, eagle-eye views, and updated satellite imagery are in, I'll switch completely without a second thought. Just not yet.
------------
To the folks on the MSN VE team:
Keep up the great work, guys! =)
I noticed on the video that when Scoble asked about this they changed the subject very quickly as if they were thinking 'oh crap - we forgot that'!
That’s right, it’s cheaper and could be done quicker than equipping handsets and cameras with expensive and inaccurate GPS. Everyone wants GPS don’t they, well a lot of handsets and now some cameras have Wi-Fi so I see this as the best way to get it sooner rather than later.
Orbit86: “but companies don't want cheap prices for internet access..means they make less profit..”
Don’t be stupid, its give and take. Why would handset managers even put Wi-Fi in handsets for profit and for free services - in many areas Wi-Fi access is free and my original point was to have this for cameras and only mobiles as an afterthought.
Orbit86: “why would Virtual Earth be embedded into Windows, We don't need to embed everything and plus not everyone needs virtual earth”
Of course we need embedded everything, everything must work together and should - that’s the utopia most are working towards. I would like virtual Earth in Windows, it should be optional for those that of course that are childish enough to be irritated with Windows but use it anyway …but that’s not my problem. All I can say is look at search technology, that’s now a part of Windows, and so will this be.
ElCapitanAmerica: “Horrible idea. A webapp like this shouldn't be intagrated into any OS, that's the point of webapps, they're integrated in browsers (ideally using well defined standards). Webapp to OS integration features are gimmicks, not great design ideas.”
Maybe I should have made suggestions more clear, those that would like it could have this option. Obeserve the picture user ‘yyy’ posted http://www.betanews.com/slideshow/MSN_Virtual_Earth/11 Now I know if I had a came across a picture on my HDD and clicked the option to show me the place in real life I would jump at it - why, because it could have been a little shanty town area of China or a back street in France from a memorable holiday, that is why. If you can’t appreciate that then don’t select the option.
Just for the record as you guessed “Webapp to OS integration” much like messenger would be what I and many want, MS 's direction is to get web apps to behave as if they’re native apps and that is exactly what we have now and will see more of.
Keep it up VE team!!
http://www.freesitemap.com
Hope you like it.
By the way i beleive currently Google API is easier to use and the zoom level 1 is better in Google it will be great if you can have a look and consider this suggestions.
Regards
Was it this board or someother... someone said that MSN maps offer better zoom than Google's.
That's NOT true. The best zoom on MSN is 150 yards. Whereas google can zoom up to 110 yards. Also the majority of the best zoom level images on google are full color while it's not so in MSN.
I also like the "Hybrid" feature in google. Somehow it feels much more seamless and neater than MSN's "with labels" images.
Finally i got to say this, imitiation is the best form of flattery.
Anyway I just had another great idea for Virtual Earth, and some of you will be pleased its a wholly online idea.
The guy who spammed this and several other stories is a bit like someone trying to hack your computer, I remember Symantec tried to obtain a hackers I.P. and then let you report it, and search for them on a map. Well considder MS Antispyware or their real-time firewall equivilent catching someone snooping on your HDD, why not use their I.P. to locate their house and then show it on Virtual Earth, I know there are concerns for accuracy but surely these will improve and its not likeSymantec was accurate.
MS have the tools now, so why not find out where uninvited intruders live and report them too. It'd be interesting to see if someone all the way in Russia hacked me in the UK.
You're so full of soundbites with little or doubtful factual substance it's unbelievable - you should be in politics
Google maps and Google earth are 2 separate products, as opposed to a single integrated one. And google didn't develop them, they, uh, bought the companies (WhereTo = Google Maps, Keyhole = Google Earth).
MS have been developing TerraServer for years - and it looks like a lot of VE will integrate with that.
So your point that MSFT are copying someone else on this one is not valid, nor is your perception that GOOG do everything from scratch. At the end of the day, people have businesses to run...
I'd put some facts in front of you to address some of your other esoteric rants but I couldn't be bothered. Got a real job to do
Is there a way that I can report bugs to VirtualEarth team?
The city of Houston and near by towns have been quite messed up within the hybrid mode. Streets label aren't even on top of street, but on top of houses.
http://virtualearth.msn.com/default.aspx?cp=29.57584|-95.626695&style=h&lvl=16&v=1
I love how its browser based also. Other programs make you download a program and then make you pay alot to be able to use that program the way you want.
As soon as virtual earth has newer pictures, i'll be the very best one.
http://gps.engadget.com/entry/1234000067037629/
http://www.grazer.de/exif_mapper/
http://www.grazer.de/grazer_home/index_en.html
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