No desktop on ARM? I know it's just speculation but it makes sense considering devs would have to recompile for ARM to get their apps on that platform anyway. Chances are they'd run poorly as well.
The WinRT/Metro noose is tightening...
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DeathByVisualStudio
If we all believed in unicorns and faries the world would be a better place.
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I think Intel put some heavy hands on Microsoft to keep Intel exclusive on the desktop. I am ok with this story but now I want a WinRT for the desktop which dumps .NET libraries and goes right to the core.
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DeathByVisualStudio
If we all believed in unicorns and faries the world would be a better place.
The only problem I have with that is there's no WinRT for Windows 7.
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I think the prohibition on desktop apps has to do with security. Desktop apps are too prone to viruses.
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W3bbo
Work hard; increase production; prevent accidents, and be happy.
My friends, I see the future:
Low-end desktops (y'know: for offices and stuff) will now simply be monitors, which a very slim form-factor computer unit tucked in the back. This has been done before, but in proprietary form-factors (by Dell, HP, etc) - but if this is standardised around ARM then they can be made even smaller, lighter, and energy efficient. The biggest component in a computer will no-longer be the CPU heatsink or the motherboard, but the hard-drive.
Besides, it's looking like Apple may even adopt ARM for its MacBooks in the coming years (think of the battery life!) - if they do this, then the rest of the industry will surely follow suit.
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CKurt
while( ( !succeed=try() ) ) { }
I'm okay with this story too, it would be to confusing for regular consumer to know why the new windows won't run there old apps (they don't know they bought an ARM cpu, they just bought a pc).
But i really really really hope: They don't call that version Windows! Because it is not, windows has the name to be compatible and run on every computer and to have a desktop. People won't understan why the "Games for Windows" games they gave don't work on this windows... I'd hate to be the person telling them afterwords. -
DCMonkey
What?!?
It seems like the story has changed back to "know one knows WTF is going on" as Thurrot (the original source of Foley's original story) has heard from another "reliable source" that the desktop will still be in the ARM version.
I'd be fine with a Metro-only ARM version for "devices" if it also meant that the Metro environment were sequestered to a Media Center like app on the desktop version so I could just not run it.
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figuerres
???
Just remember this untill we have facts:
WIndows NT used to be compiled for multiple CPU types, Mips, Alpha and intell (i am not sure about others). Microsoft used to sell the C / C++ compilers to support this.
so technichally I see no reason why they could not do a full build for each cpu if they want to.
the real question is will they , not can they.
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W3bbo
Work hard; increase production; prevent accidents, and be happy.
3 minutes ago, figuerres wrote
Just remember this untill we have facts:
WIndows NT used to be compiled for multiple CPU types, Mips, Alpha and intell (i am not sure about others). Microsoft used to sell the C / C++ compilers to support this.
After a few minutes' research, here:
NT 3.1 = IA-32 (x86), MIPS, and Alpha
NT 3.5 = IA-32, MIPS, and Alpha
NT 3.51 = IA-32, MIPS, Alpha, and PowerPC
NT 4.0 = IA-32, MIPS, Alpha, and PowerPC
NT 5.0 = IA-32, IA-64 (Itanium)
NT 5.1 = IA-32, IA-64
NT 5.2 = IA-32, IA-64, AMD64 (x64)
NT 6.0 = IA-32, IA-64, AMD64
NT 6.1 = IA-32, IA-64, AMD64. (With IA-32 support removed in Server 2008 R2)
NT 6.2 = IA-32, AMD64, ARM (No word on IA-64 support in Server 8).So as you can see, the NT kernel has always been available for than one platform (it's just that IA-32 is the predominant one that's always been available).
I guess that Windows 8 is available in IA-32 for the sake of backwards compatibility (no 16-bit support in AMD64 Windows) and because it's touted as being compatible with computers that run Windows Vista, though I do expect Windows 9 to ditch 32-bit support because no new machine in the past couple of years comes lacking 64-bit processors and people want more than 3GB of RAM).
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elmer
I'm on my very last life.
I see the issue as simply one of desktop applications.
It's one thing to provide the O/S for multiple hardware platforms, it's an entirely different matter to convince developers to port their existing apps.
This was the problem with MIPS and ALPHA support in the past, nobody was interested in porting their x86 apps.
IMHO, traditional desktop hardware for business is history, and will be usurped by the use of improved RDP (or whatever) terminal services, so that desktop apps can continue to run in their x86 (etc) environment (i.e. Servers) while allowing the use of ARM and Metro.
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CKurt
while( ( !succeed=try() ) ) { }
@elmer: That brings up a good point.
An ARM/Metro only tablet can be used to access any old desktop app because there is a metro remote desktop app (which is a suprisingly good app)
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DeathByVisualStudio
If we all believed in unicorns and faries the world would be a better place.
46 minutes ago, elmer wrote
*snip*
IMHO, traditional desktop hardware for business is history, and will be usurped by the use of improved RDP (or whatever) terminal services, so that desktop apps can continue to run in their x86 (etc) environment (i.e. Servers) while allowing the use of ARM and Metro.
Awesome! So when I buy and Windows 8 ARM tablet I'll also buy a PC (or server) to run the desktop stuff from. This sure sounds like the iPad/iPhone launches -- tied to the PC or MAC. Copy...Paste...repeat.
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figuerres
???
53 minutes ago, CKurt wrote
@elmer: That brings up a good point.
An ARM/Metro only tablet can be used to access any old desktop app because there is a metro remote desktop app (which is a suprisingly good app)
question that will come up:
the iPad can use RDP apps to do the access to desktops also. why buy a windows 8 tablet if the iPad does the same stuff and has more apps ?
i am not saying that win 8 will not have apps etc... I am asking how will Microsoft and the PC OEM's make a windows 8 tablet something that mass numbers of consumers will want to buy ?
this is a very very important question for us as developers .... casue if win 8 is *NOT* able to get critical mass then we will not be developing for it. I am already getting asked about developing for the iPad at work and we have done windows apps for years now.
Hello Balmer, Hello Guthere, Hello Sinofsky time to wake up and meet the real world...
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magicalclick
remember the flow
Inornically I am ok with WP Tablet, but, I am not ok with Metro only Tablet.
I will stay with PC/Notebook and WP Cell Phone, no tablet for now. Or I will sadly get an iPad if Win8 Tablet failed and no WP Tablet I can buy. -
ARM shmarm. x86 processors are becoming more and more energy efficient, while ARM processors are becoming more and more power hungry. When they meet in the middle, the platform that has the most software support will win.
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evildictaitor
strcpy(malloc(4), "Oh noes!");
13 hours ago, W3bbo wrote
NT 6.2 = IA-32, AMD64, ARM (No word on IA-64 support in Server 8).
There isn't going to be support for IA64. (http://www.tomshardware.com/news/windows-server-itanium-nehalem-xeon-windows-server-2008-r2,10075.html)
21 hours ago, DeathByVisualStudio wrote
No desktop on ARM? ... it's just speculation
And let's just remind everybody that this is, in fact, just speculation.
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Dovella
Go Microsoft !!!!!!!
Why you want X86 app for W8 tab ARM ?
X86 app is not finger friendly, is not for tablet.
Im very happy to restart.
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blowdart
Peek-a-boo
21 minutes ago, Dovella wrote
Why you want X86 app for W8 tab ARM ?
X86 app is not finger friendly, is not for tablet.
Im very happy to restart.
How does that make sense? The finger friendliness of an app has nothing to do with the chipset it runs on.
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