My feelings are that the bright minds at channel 9 have been prescient and illuminating. My biggest dissapointment is ready-ness of the tools but we have yet to hear from the Visual StudioTeam. I don't think I will be downloading the preview until I hear further about the new API's.

I also think that my salary/wages comes from businesses that can afford budgets to allow products to be created, and that there is little to nothing for most businesses in this release, but a hell of a lot for users and tablets. This is a client focussed release, with Microsoft traditional clients being given the cold shoulder. I think this will be a success, as the applications and usability are attractive, but a lot of what has been shown will be copied easily by competitors, so it is a tricky one to call.

i agree that there was a lot of user centric stuff, but they did try to show that pro users will have their fill as well, that keyboard junkies will be able to use win8 fully as well.

what i'd really liked to have seen more of is how immersive apps work in desktop mode [as they can be pinned to the taskbar] will you be able to run them in window mode?

Also, what about the win+<0..9> shourtcuts will work in immersive mode (if anything)

i'll reserve my judgement intil 3 am tonight when the dev preview is available for download

 -edit-

hm, the stream might be down now

http://rd3d2.wordpress.com/2011/09/13/build-conference-shooting-range-beta-availability/

http://channel9.msdn.com/Events/BUILD/BUILD2011/TOOL-531T

http://channel9.msdn.com/Events/BUILD/BUILD2011/PLAT-751T

hellooo.... "Xbox LIVE, Microsoft's premier entertainment service, is coming to Windows 8. Whether you are developing a game or another kind of entertainment app for Windows 8, Xbox LIVE can help your app stand out in the crowd and help engage and delight users. You will learn about how to implement our well-loved features like Achievements, Multiplayer, Avatars and Community and brand new ones like roaming storage and profiles.  "

http://channel9.msdn.com/Events/BUILD/BUILD2011/PLAT-756T

xbox live? not games for windows....  should be interesting, maybe those xbox app dreams should not be laid to rest yet

@PerfectPhase:

indeed

As I'm now starved of content, I think I'll sleep now until 3am GMT

Sure, they didn't talk about the enterprise feature sets, but the performance and footprint improvements alone should be great for businesses. It lets them get more value out of their workstation purchases.

PDC hasn't traditionally focused on enterprisey stuff, so I wouldn't expect build to change that.

13 seconds ago,kettch wrote

PDC hasn't traditionally focused on enterprisey stuff, so I wouldn't expect build to change that.

At previous PDCs they announced and demo'd things like WPF, WCF, .NET, COM, a whole series of platforms used by "enterprise".

i think that's what they'll do on tomorrows keynote..

winRT is com btw. com.vnext:)

And a list of Enterprise questions as long as my arm (and a bit more) but hopefully now the silence is lifted we'll start to see more of that story unfold too.

i think winRT only wraps win32 and provides metadata that the various programming models consume. winRT probably doesnt do very much in itself

18 minutes ago,PerfectPhase wrote

No @ch9live I'm distraught

 

native apps wont want to have the winRT overhead, also native devs want that win32, to the metal feel..

my guess is as good as anyones though

45 minutes ago,PerfectPhase wrote

No @ch9live I'm distraught

ok, that does it, i'm switching to iOS development...

oh, wait, objective-C? really?

13 minutes ago,Simo wrote

hmm . Anyone any idea how I can catch Sinofsky's keynote now that it's over?

Go to http://www.buildwindows.com/, start the video player, jump to the red mark.

how is xp an obstacle to using wpf?

anyhoo, we've all seem what a powerful force consumer-ifying things can be.. alot of business folk have iphones even they arent really tailored for business, especially compared to win mobile

hyperV is also a pretty business centric feature too i'd say

sounds more like a hardware issue

well ive been writing complex wpf apps for xp for a while and they worked just fine.. perhaps it works better in some scenarios than others

1. .NET desktop development is all but dead. ASP.NET will live on, but the future of desktop apps is WinRT using C#/XAML or JS/HTML. Even Silverlight seems to be on the way out. Did anyone notice him running WinRT-targeting code on the phone?

2. The smaller footprint, insanely fast boot times, and attention to detail (e.g. upgraded Task Manager, taskbar on both monitors) makes me excited to see what else is in there.

3. Roaming profiles in the cloud are awesome.

4. The ability to save a "reset" image is fantastic for home users and OEMs. No more searching for the recovery disc or waiting hours for the recovery partition to install everything. Just click reset and you're back in business.

5. App store listing non-immersive apps is a great idea and is sure to get the number of apps way past Apple's AppStore numbers very quickly.

6. Support for x86 and ARM in new apps without recompiling.

1 minute ago,vesuvius wrote

Particularly in image processing and video processing applications xp is an impediment

Thankfully the single best piece of news in the entire keynote was that XP is now running on less devices than Windows 7.

1 hour ago,PerfectPhase wrote

Anyone know what the '+ add all videos to queue' option on the video pages does?  Is there a download manger somewhere or a private favourites/playlist?

There is not currently a download manager or favorites list but we have been working on a personal queue feature like Hulu or Netflix. Looks like parts of it got accidentally exposed this morning with all of the Build updates happening.

2 minutes ago,Adam​Speight2008 wrote

When is the Day 1 KeyNote going to be available? I was watch in delay and then it just cut out at about 02:15:00, was the Live Streaming finished?

My stream ended around 3:45:00 (started around 1:10:00).

16 minutes ago,spivonious wrote

My thoughts after finishing up the keynote.

1. .NET desktop development is all but dead. ASP.NET will live on, but the future of desktop apps is WinRT using C#/XAML or JS/HTML. Even Silverlight seems to be on the way out. Did anyone notice him running WinRT-targeting code on the phone?

I don't know how you can say that. All of the sample C# code that I saw in the keynote had .NET namespace references, as far as I could tell. Maybe those namespaces weren't technically part of the .NET framework, but as long as you're using C# and can bind data to UI elements using XAML mark-up, who really cares? 

25 minutes ago,spivonious wrote

My thoughts after finishing up the keynote.

1. .NET desktop development is all but dead. ASP.NET will live on, but the future of desktop apps is WinRT using C#/XAML or JS/HTML. Even Silverlight seems to be on the way out. Did anyone notice him running WinRT-targeting code on the phone?

Wait, how is .NET development all but dead if desktops apps will be WinRT using C#/XAML?

Edit: Oh, I see what WinRT actually is now. Huh.

5 minutes ago,cbae wrote

*snip*

I don't know how you can say that. All of the sample C# code that I saw in the keynote had .NET namespace references, as far as I could tell. Maybe those namespaces weren't technically part of the .NET framework, but as long as you're using C# and can bind data to UI elements using XAML mark-up, who really cares? 

They said that they went to great lengths to get WinRT namespaces to match .NET namespaces so that apps wouldn't need too many changes. I'm sure we'll learn a lot more at the WinRT session, but .NET was not mentioned once, only the languages were (C#/VB/XAML). Right now it seems that WinRT is a native wrapper around Win32, almost like an updated MFC.

i think tomorrows keynote will make alot of these things much clearer, it seems like microsoft is always putting the developer stuff in the day2 keynote. the last two pdcs both had [boring] azure stuff on day one and devdiv stuff on day two

i might agree that parts of .net and silverlight will take a backstage to win8/winRT apis such as directUI and the network stuff, but that is pretty much transparent as far as i can tell

we'll be using a diffrent namespace and reference some other dll for some stuff, thats all.

Eg some form alternative stream. If this stream doesn't work, try the other

13 seconds ago,Bas wrote

*snip*

 

Wait, how is .NET all but dead if ASP.NET lives on and desktops apps will be C#/XAML?

Well, technically the .NET framework is just a collection of DLLs, independent of C#, the language, and XAML, the markup. WinRT could represent just a different collection of DLLs that you now have to use with C# and XAML. In either case, it doesn't change much in terms of how you develop an application. You may just have to reference different namespaces. That's all.

11 minutes ago,spivonious wrote

*snip*

They said that they went to great lengths to get WinRT namespaces to match .NET namespaces so that apps wouldn't need too many changes. I'm sure we'll learn a lot more at the WinRT session, but .NET was not mentioned once, only the languages were (C#/VB/XAML). Right now it seems that WinRT is a native wrapper around Win32, almost like an updated MFC.

I actually didn't catch the part about namespace matching, but it seems like a no-brainer to do this. There's really nothing technically wrong with how the namespaces are currently organized in the .NET framework. It wouldn't have made much sense to reorganize everything in WinRT. To me, the only difference now between the new desktop application stack and Silverlight OOB is that you no longer need to download and install Silverlight separately.

It couldn't be a bandwidth issue I have a 50Mb cable connection.

       #if Windows8
     using Windows.System;
     #elif Silverlight
    using System.Windows;
     #elif Winforms
     using System.Windows.Forms
     #endif
      
     namespace I_See_What_You_Did_There
    {
    }

Microsoft loves sending mix messages, Steve S. just want up there and pimped Win 7 then pimped win 8. Many companies just moved to win 7 from xp (not vista) and they normally skip a windows release. Anyway to make the point unless companies have the extra resource and a business need they will not be make apps just for Win 8.

This makes me think that for a while the best way to target all windows versions is .net 4 or Silverlight (which can run on xp, 7, and 8) and Mac in the case of silverlight;