Build - The Discussion

@cbae:

i think tomorrows keynote will make alot of these things much clearer, it seems like microsoft is always putting the developer stuff in the day2 keynote. the last two pdcs both had [boring] azure stuff on day one and devdiv stuff on day two

i might agree that parts of .net and silverlight will take a backstage to win8/winRT apis such as directUI and the network stuff, but that is pretty much transparent as far as i can tell

we'll be using a diffrent namespace and reference some other dll for some stuff, thats all.

@spivonious: For the next conference, I think Microsoft copy the "Live" steam to a computer in back ground. The seamlessly redirect to the "Copy" when switch of the Live Stream.

Eg some form alternative stream. If this stream doesn't work, try the other

@AdamSpeight2008: I had my live stream paused well after the real keynote ended and it still resumed fine. Maybe you had lost connection somewhere?

Build website just showing a "The keynote video will be available shortly" thing for me now. Damn, I still have an hour to kill.

13 seconds ago,Bas wrote

*snip*

 

Wait, how is .NET all but dead if ASP.NET lives on and desktops apps will be C#/XAML?

Well, technically the .NET framework is just a collection of DLLs, independent of C#, the language, and XAML, the markup. WinRT could represent just a different collection of DLLs that you now have to use with C# and XAML. In either case, it doesn't change much in terms of how you develop an application. You may just have to reference different namespaces. That's all.

@Bas: Same here.

11 minutes ago,spivonious wrote

*snip*

They said that they went to great lengths to get WinRT namespaces to match .NET namespaces so that apps wouldn't need too many changes. I'm sure we'll learn a lot more at the WinRT session, but .NET was not mentioned once, only the languages were (C#/VB/XAML). Right now it seems that WinRT is a native wrapper around Win32, almost like an updated MFC.

I actually didn't catch the part about namespace matching, but it seems like a no-brainer to do this. There's really nothing technically wrong with how the namespaces are currently organized in the .NET framework. It wouldn't have made much sense to reorganize everything in WinRT. To me, the only difference now between the new desktop application stack and Silverlight OOB is that you no longer need to download and install Silverlight separately.

It's working now. 

It couldn't be a bandwidth issue I have a 50Mb cable connection.

@spivonious: it depends on what you mean by ".NET". To me (and I guess to quite a few developers out there), .NET is a set of languages, libraries and technologies; the CLR is just an implementation detail. They already made major changes to the CLR in the past, I don't see why this should be any different.

@spivonious: if you see the keynote they showed a existing silverlight  application from scott guthrie's website compile and run in windows 8 as it is .. just that .. as expected it did not have touch input support ... and then they showed how easy it will be for a properly developed silverlight applications to be touch enabled using few lines of code ....

I'm as "un-discouraged" after today's news as I had been "discouraged" before.  Looks like they gave IT departments a perfect alternative to iStuff and the consumer market without splitting the two.

http://codepaste.net/fd9r4h    how code will like look like ..

       #if Windows8
     using Windows.System;
     #elif Silverlight
    using System.Windows;
     #elif Winforms
     using System.Windows.Forms
     #endif
      
     namespace I_See_What_You_Did_There
    {
    }

@xgamer: Considering how much Microsoft likes to pimp jQuery, I wouldn't have put it past them to have prepended all the .NET namespaces with "$" for WinRT were it not an illegal filename character.

Here is something that will need to be cleared. I did not hear nor do i think that WinRT will be back compatible with windows 7. There is no way that an IT department or ISV will write an app to use WinRT if it will not run on windows 7.  

Microsoft loves sending mix messages, Steve S. just want up there and pimped Win 7 then pimped win 8. Many companies just moved to win 7 from xp (not vista) and they normally skip a windows release. Anyway to make the point unless companies have the extra resource and a business need they will not be make apps just for Win 8.

This makes me think that for a while the best way to target all windows versions is .net 4 or Silverlight (which can run on xp, 7, and 8) and Mac in the case of silverlight;