to upgrade to Win7 or Win8 cause of major changes in the Register and  UAC.

So, either microsoft add HTML5 support and fix all Javascriptbugs or many people will

leave Windows enviroment. I will 4 sure. Not many page you can use nowdays

with IE8, javascript error or canvas is needed. I has been around since dos 6

all the way, i think i will have to leave microsoft now..

So i has been a microsoft junkie and still use XP pro and Outlook express,

but cant do it anymore. Even this forum cant handle XP Pro IE8 .

Now i cant see anymore as i type below the screen in the gray field with

copyringht 2012 Microsoft and the links. Now im off that , im out in the clear again the white

text had zero opacity, now im below the gray field. Shall i say more?

When i found the bug when writings this even in Microsofts forum i really lost my hope...

1 hour ago, cheong wrote

Wait... I'm still using WinXP with IE8 in my company to visit this site. What problem did you see?

It was * time at steve01's home.

Are there web-sites you use that require IE6/7/8? If so that is the problem! Tell these authors that the web was made for users certainly not for developers who want the world to stop spinning.

6 hours ago, steve01 wrote

I has been around since dos 6

all the way, i think i will have to leave microsoft now..

Which other operating system do you plan migrating to that does not have a type of UAC? Most Linux distributions have it too and on OSX it's even worse: you need to give your account password to install updates or applications and you need to give your Apple ID password if you want to buy/install/update something from the App store/Itunes.

9 hours ago, steve01 wrote

[quote]

I has been around since dos 6 all the way, i think i will have to leave microsoft now.

All the way ... until Windows XP where you stopped. Microsoft has moved on from XP, even if you haven't.

Good luck with your move to Linux or OSX. 

7 minutes ago, fanbaby wrote

I find the way this thread is going bothersome, but hey what do i know. 

You're bothered that nobody else is recommending a browser peddled by an advertising company that you have a hard-on for because they support some highly-visible open source initiatives like Android while you ignore the fact that they keep their real revenue-generating products under proprietary lock and key? Is that what you're alluding to?

3 hours ago, Harlequin wrote

I recommend wiping computer and putting DOS 6.0 on...then you can have word processors, fun ASCII-based games like MORIA I used to play, you can hook up your old dot matrix printer to get more use out of it, and you can hop onto BBS to socialize with others.

You can still get text based rogue clones on windows. And of course, the inspired by Rogue Nethack

18 minutes ago, fanbaby wrote

@cbae: No. The fact that you are ganging up on one of your own.

Sorry, you've lost me; what do you mean by "one of your own"?

Herbie

18 minutes ago, fanbaby wrote

@Dr Herbie:Maybe one of your own was poor wording, but it's obvious the OP likes windows, and especially IE.

He obviously doesn't like them all that much since he's "threatening" to leave Windows altogether because Microsoft doesn't plan on rewriting IE10 to run on XP.

XP actually is the most stable windows release , and YES i have opera,mozilla,safari,firefox installed aswell. BUT i also use programs like "firedaemon.com". Actually the support for winxp dont expire until 2013 afaik, and many companys still use it.

I also use Linux, but i have 10-20 ppl call me each week about the XP problems.

And i DOO have a 15 year old car that work like a clockwork! Sorry if i disturbed your Bill Gates lovers that runs W7+ , i have tryed it and its su-- real bad.

So i must stop writing now as the box expands down to the grey field below.. null is not a objekt , rite .. fk noobs

22 minutes ago, steve01 wrote

So, this place is full of trolls. Like i care ! LOL

XP actually is the most stable windows release , and YES i have opera,mozilla,safari,firefox installed aswell. BUT i also use programs like "firedaemon.com". Actually the support for winxp dont expire until 2013 afaik, and many companys still use it.

There are companies like Fry's that still used DOS-based programs on XP for their inventory control and CRM. The difference is that they're not complaining that IE can't render HTML5.

Seeing all these meaningless comments makes me laugh a lot though...

Look on this picture of the bug , not present in firefox,safari,chrome,netscape6... bla bla bla

http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=zk49he&s=6

LOL

<img src="Content/Assets/Images/logo.png"/>

Missing a alt="" .. dont good, in here and all..

You can find my spelling errors, fine.. But you can not code a XHTML site and you advertise your skill in MSDN, ROTFLMAO !

Have you consider some margins an paddings?

This will forward all IE8 users to firefox !

var canvasSupported = !!document.createElement("canvas").getContext;
if (!canvasSupported) window.location="firefox.com";

I feel good publishing the script here in MSDN, i i did reconsider i WILL use XP for 5 years to come.        Sorry for the whitespaces i was behind the submit button.

So, you sissed my little secrete, i was a troll. Dont feed me.

1 minute ago, steve01 wrote

And do what , sue me for telling the true ??

 

The true what?

Can you type perfect correct german language?

Seems the thread is going more and more offtopic !

And its seem the ones hanging around here since early 2000 is the biggest trolls.

I started this thread here as a recomendation from Microsoft support,

But its seems there is no Microsof employes around?

and this errors happends all the time.

5 minutes ago, steve01 wrote

Well, im not english.

Me neither.

Can you type perfect correct german language?

I could, but this is not a deutsche Sprache forum.

Seems the thread is going more and more offtopic !

And its seem the ones hanging around here since early 2000 is the biggest trolls.

Look, "steve" (last I checked, not a German name), you come in guns blazing with a weirdly worded post and immediately start antagonizing everyone. We point out that maybe you should let go of an OS that was superceded in late 2006 and, if you really want to use it, there are alternative browsers that would satisfy your yearnings, and you point out that a website that starts with <!DOCTYPE html> is not XHTML (really? Wow, a winner is yuo!) and then proceed in calling everyone a troll (note: there are no trolls on internet forums. There is "trolling", that means leaving a bait behind you hoping that fishes follow it. Well, I guess you achieved that, at least)

Seriously, you've done your piece of performance art, now it's time to gracefully back away and register again with a different nick and use some more elegant tactics to get your (potentially valid) point across.

Auf Wiedersehen!

The meaning of this thread was to *wake up" the developers on IE8 to at least fix the Javascript issues that are present. Btw there was a spelling error on your rage reply "yuo" is actually spelled "you". I wont leave, i will follow this thread until i deside to stop following it. OK!

Im not a computer you can tell "break;"  I will be the last poster in this thread, and thats a promise!

I still havnt got the answers i want, so then i will start a new thread!

Sorry for the typo "looked" - "locked" ..

26 minutes ago, steve01 wrote

the developers on IE8

The developers on IE8 have all moved on to IE9 and then 10. Just like Microsoft as a whole has moved on from XP to Vista to Win7 and now Win8. XP is 12 years old. Expecting Microsoft to support it fully when it was superceeded 6 years ago and has been out of mainstream support for three years (it is currently in extended support, which means security updates only) is simply unreasonable. It makes no business sense for MS to do as you ask, and it's not going to happen no matter how loud you yell.

There are alternative browsers you can use, which have been pointed out. You can also switch to a different OS, but as others have commented, that's likely to be more painful that switching to Windows 7 (and by the way, UAC is far less intrusive in Windows 7 than it was in Vista, and can be turned off if you really want, though I wouldn't recommend it).

I don't understand where you expect this thread to go from here. You've gotten the only answer you're ever going to get for this question. Either you upgrade to Windows 7, use a different browser, or use a different OS. There will never be functionality updates to IE8 or any new version of IE for XP. Maybe that's not the answer you wanted to hear, but it's the truth, so repeating the question isn't going to change it.

In addition, there are very few Microsoft employees who post in the Coffeehouse, and there are none from the IE team as far as I'm aware.

We will see, NOW IM OFF!

Waste of time.

SIgh.........................

In addition, there are very few Microsoft employees who post in the Coffeehouse, and there are none from the IE team as far as I'm aware.

http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/BruceMorgan

I agree that this thread is totally pointless.

26 seconds ago, steve01 wrote

> don't understand where you expect this thread to go from here

XP is still supported untiil 2013

Extended support, which means security updates only. Mainstream support ended in 2009.

and still used by hundred of thousands of endcustumers that will not úpgrade to WIN7 and should be able to log in to banks internet services to pay their bills.

They can, just possibly not using IE.

You can write that a 100 times, but the answer will be the same a 100 times: there will be no further upgrades to IE on XP. I know it's not the answer you want to hear, but it's the only true answer.

51 seconds ago, 01001001 wrote

@Sven Groot:

*snip*

http://channel9.msdn.com/Niners/BruceMorgan

I agree that this thread is totally pointless.

He hasn't been seen in the Coffeehouse for 3 years at least. I'm talking about right now, not any time in the past.

I'm talking about right now, not any time in the past.

There was no such limiting clause in your original statement. You're adding it so you can reassure yourself that you are correct when in fact you just didn't think about it too hard. But hey, whatever.

57 minutes ago, 01001001 wrote

@Sven Groot:

*snip*

There was no such limiting clause in your original statement. You're adding it so you can reassure yourself that you are correct when in fact you just didn't think about it too hard. But hey, whatever.

It's true I forgot about Bruce. But that doesn't change the fact he's unlikely to answer the OP's question since he's not still active.

3 hours ago, steve01 wrote

Well, its hard to handle the facts. But im not afraid of Microsoft, i have paid loads of money and the support for XP is still active. Point 1 thing out i done that is incorrect!

Well thinking support means you're going to get everything from Win8 back ported would be one thing that's incorrect

1 hour ago, 01001001 wrote

@Sven Groot:

*snip*

There was no such limiting clause in your original statement.

Except for the user of the present tense, you mean?

Its about 2-3 years since Microsoft stopped selling the OS Windows XP. So do you think its OK that IE8 not even can execute Javascript correct? Seems still no one get it in here, Microsoft WILL loose $ i they not upgrade IE8 to at least support basic Javascripts. All open free browsers support that + HTML5, and i promise you my company and all companys in my counrty i have contact with feels exactly the same way. MY recomendation to MY customers will be , never ever buy any Microsoft prooduct and start using free OS like Ubuntu IF they not upgrade the IE8. And thats not likely you experts in here say. Hence , ordinary people that buyed a computer 5 years ago dont think they have an old computer!

1 hour ago, steve01 wrote

@blowdart:

Its about 2-3 years since Microsoft stopped selling the OS Windows XP. So do you think its OK that IE8 not even can execute Javascript correct?

IE8 did just fine when it was released. You can't complain that an eleven-year-old OS doesn't support the latest and greatest (well, obviously you can (and do) complain, but nothing will come from it).

Seems still no one get it in here, Microsoft WILL loose $ i they not upgrade IE8 to at least support basic Javascripts.

Got any figures to back that up? If you can offer concrete proof (not anecdotal evidence, which is all you've provided so far) that it would end up costing money, maybe MS would listen.

And thats not likely you experts in here say. Hence , ordinary people that buyed a computer 5 years ago dont think they have an old computer!

If they bought a computer 5 years ago they probably have Windows Vista.

Yes, lots of businesses are still running on XP. Guess what happpens when XP goes out of extended support next year. Nothing. Businesses will still be running XP, just like lots of businesses are still using DOS. When I worked for Blockbuster Video in college, their POS systems were using OS/2.

Of those, only the first two are legitimate problems. The last only requires the proper application of a blunt instrument.

Vista was sold at the time but MY customers backed to XP cause of all the problems with Vista at the time. I could show statistics from my 10 domains. What OS ppl are using and what browser they use. Obviously you in here dont have a clue about how man ppl still using IE8 and XP.

>Got any figures to back that up?

Sure, i sell about 100 computers a year , and i will change to another OS for my comming sales. Cause all the support issues i now get from old customers blaming me for XP/IE8 dont work on most webpages, they dont have the skills to setup new browsers and emailclients. I have to do that. So probably the next meaningless reply will be: So, your 100 computers is no big deal for Microsoft. Completely true, but im not alone as a company to do this. Do you want proof of this aswell ?

10 minutes ago, steve01 wrote

>If they bought a computer 5 years ago they probably have Windows Vista.

Vista was sold at the time but MY customers backed to XP cause of all the problems with Vista at the time. I could show statistics from my 10 domains. What OS ppl are using and what browser they use. Obviously you in here dont have a clue about how man ppl still using IE8 and XP.

>Got any figures to back that up?

Sure, i sell about 100 computers a year , and i will change to another OS for my comming sales. Cause all the support issues i now get from old customers blaming me for XP/IE8 dont work on most webpages, they dont have the skills to setup new browsers and emailclients. I have to do that. So probably the next meaningless reply will be: So, your 100 computers is no big deal for Microsoft. Completely true, but im not alone as a company to do this. Do you want proof of this aswell ?

 

So wait, you're upset that you get to sell new services to your customers? Better yet, offer to sell them a new computer running Windows 7.

19 minutes ago, spivonious wrote

*snip*

So wait, you're upset that you get to sell new services to your customers? Better yet, offer to sell them a new computer running Windows 7.

I've found that the way people react to being upgraded to Windows 7 from XP is very much determined by the attitude of the vendor. I know somebody who begrudgingly upgrades customers, and it turns out that his customers are grumpy about the switch. I was worried about training issues when I started having customers who needed new computers, but I went into it with a positive attitude, and was very positive with the customers. Wouldn't you know it, they all universally love their new computers and have zero problems making the transition.

Moral of the story: Expect trouble, and you'll get it.

EDIT: I'm still glad I don't do support consulting any more. Development requires much less dusty spelunking under desks.

Should he switch to Chrome and never use IE again? Maybe.... because MS doesn't care about him. And why would he want to tell Chrome users to move to IE when IE doesn't work on so many Microsoft OS? The most logical answer is, use FF/Chrome all the way. The fact that he desire this is because he still cares about IE, but, that's an irrational reaction.

I sell quite a lot of Mac notebooks to many old customers. Is it trolling to tell the truth?

The main difference with Microsoft and Apple is that they dont turn their back on customers like Microsoft have done in this case. And like someone said , I DO like Internet Explorer and I DO think WinXP is the best windows OS ever made including all present versions.

I leave u guys alone in your sandbox now, dont have time to argue with you!

1. Brings html5 to your clients
2. Very fast and easy install (similar to flash player)
3. Doesn't require network manager to install or authorize it
4. The shell is still IE, so favorites, settings, etc. work like before

On a different note, it seems you blame Microsoft for this situation but not yourself or the person that designed this app that works only on windows xp or only on IE.

There is a bug with the the input box on this page when using IE8. Thank you for pointing it out. I am working on a fix right now and this problem will be fixed the next time we update the site.

1 hour ago, kettch wrote

*snip*

Moral of the story: Expect trouble, and you'll get it.

+1; Added to my utility library. Kudos.

@Geoffreyk: I had the Submit button within the input box until I upgraded to IE9... on Win7.. nice catch and response.

5 hours ago, fanbaby wrote

I've heard that Chrome Frame (That's a complete chorme browser running inside IE) can be installed without admin privileges. So chrome frame:

1. Brings html5 to your clients
2. Very fast and easy install (similar to flash player)
3. Doesn't require network manager to install or authorize it
4. The shell is still IE, so favorites, settings, etc. work like before

In my (limited) experience, Chrome Frame is pretty flakey... and I've encountered lots of issues with it, resulting in me needing to uninstall it on all the machines I support.

I've never even been able to get it to work reliably with Google's own AdWords and Analytics sites.

I think you'd be better served to just install/use Chrome or FireFox than mess about with Frame.

The answer is that IE10 won't be released on Windows XP. It's not going to happen. Deal with it.

Also Apple don't turn their back on customers WTF? I have a PPC Mac that doesn't work because Apple dropped support for it.

@steve01:

There is a bug with the the input box on this page when using IE8. Thank you for pointing it out. I am working on a fix right now and this problem will be fixed the next time we update the site.

 

No problem, i do cross browser test on my homepages to support ALL browsers since WinXP.

I promised myself to not reply anymore, but since a site admin replyed i think my other points is considered aswell. I dont expect IE9 or IE10 on XP. Have i said that? I expect that Javascript should work for my old customers IE8 who is calling ME for support. Please stop saying "Get over it" I now using Chrome cause of  this sites bug. I will survive without IE8/OE , OK?  

I made may point public on MSDN , and a Microsoft employe answered it. End of story!

From "Webalizer" on one of my domains today. Look on place #3

Parts of my homepage cant be viewed without HTML5/Canvas.

All those user has being denied some pages for 1 year cause of the limitation of Canvas in IE8, they dont seem to have "got over it"..

Or you can keep wanting stuff that WILL NEVER BE DONE FOR YOU.

It's a fairly easy choice fro this side of the pond...

And yes, get over it already.

3 hours ago, steve01 wrote

*snip*

Parts of my homepage cant be viewed without HTML5/Canvas.

Don't use canvas.

@PaoloM : Get a life 

Keep *bumping* the thread , i will answer all your newbie questions. Im sure Microsoft will be happy of your comments keeping this thread on the top 10 ! Thanx a lot !

Im sure Microsoft will be happy of your comments keeping this thread on the top 10!

I think you massively over-estimate how much Microsoft cares about this thread, or this forum for that matter.

The decision to keep IE-10 on Win8 and not allow IE-9 on XP was a board-level decision. It's not going to change no matter how much you stamp and shout.

If your users want to use Microsoft's best free products, they'll need to keep their OS up-to-date.

Otherwise there are plenty of non-Microsoft alternatives, and frankly Microsoft doesn't really care if you leave. It's not like you were giving them money anyway, since you clearly haven't bought an OS from them in the past five years.

21.93% on Win7, 3.57% on Vista, 20.44% on XP, and 4.92% iOS.

What about the other 49.14%?

Herbie

4 hours ago, steve01 wrote

Once again 2 meaningless comments. Dont use canvas! Well actually in this case I dont use Canvas, its a hardware device that genarate a HTML5 page i embed in a iframe on this website. So there is nothing I can do. But i get dayly mails why they cant see that Page. I do show a JQuery-Dialog telling they are not using a HTML5 browser and should upgrade their browser, what more can I do? Like you are telling me its 2012 and i cant demand the hardware manufactory to use HTML 4 on their new products.

So basically people complain that they can't use your stuff on their outdated software, and you're telling them to upgrade.

Why does this sound familiar?

Only did read the first line of your post, actually you dont know about the conversation i have with Microsoft in my mailbox. Do you? They are working on this pages IE8 bug because i was annoyed with it. Seems like they care about my points!

@Dr.Hebie

Good point but in this case its impossible for the hardware vendor to change, as they use most of the new HTML5 features to produce a small HTML.file. I totally agree that is not likely that microsoft will update IE8 to support HTML5. But hey i did give it a go !

@ spivonius 

Im not forcing the visitors to upgrade, actually im working on a different HTML4-page to present the same thing for all the IE8 users. So the HTML5 Dialog is just a temporary solution. Btw, the products i talk about is ControlByWeb.com hardware if anyone is interested. 

@ Bas - Youre summary is very interesting.. sigh..

12 minutes ago, steve01 wrote

@evildictaitor

Only did read the first line of your post, actually you dont know about the conversation i have with Microsoft in my mailbox. Do you? They are working on this pages IE8 bug because i was annoyed with it. Seems like they care about my points!

Channel9 is another matter entirely. Channel9 should fix their site to work on IE8. This is easy for them to do, and involves no internal Microsoft politics.

That is an entirely different matter to making IE10 available on Windows XP, which is hard and involves lots of internal Microsoft politics.

Channel9 is another matter entirely. Channel9 should fix their site to work on IE8. This is easy for them to do, and involves no internal Microsoft politics.

That is an entirely different matter to making IE10 available on Windows XP, which is hard and involves lots of internal Microsoft politics.

Correct, but it is Microsoft employees that will fix the bug on Channel9 forum owned and supported by Microsoft™

And you keep talking about XP - IE9/IE10 i have never ever expected that. But i think they should fix their Javascript bugs on IE8. Then the customers will buy Win7 - Win 8.

And you said i havnt sold Microsoft products for the past 5 years. WTF? Have i ever said i didnt  sell W7 to customers until this day? I have sold W7 installed in my computers, the last one was delivered last week. But I dont like W7 and will continue to use XP Pro !

7 minutes ago, steve01 wrote

*snip*

Correct, but it is Microsoft employees that will fix the bug on Channel9 forum owned and supported by Microsoft™

Don't worry though, if they fix this bug there's still about a milion left to go around (seriously, forget IE8; this forum is seriously buggy regardless of browser).

13 minutes ago, steve01 wrote

*snip*

Correct, but it is Microsoft employees that will fix the bug on Channel9 forum owned and supported by Microsoft™

Channel9 developers != IE10 developers.

Channel9 developers are allowed to make Channel9 work for XP.

IE10 developers are not allowed to make IE10 work for XP.

18 minutes ago, steve01 wrote

And you keep talking about XP - IE9/IE10 i have never ever expected that. But i think they should fix their Javascript bugs on IE8. Then the customers will buy Win7 - Win 8.

This statement makes absolutely no sense to me.  Why would fixing a bug in an old piece of software get people to upgrade to new software?  They could just upgrade to the new software and fix the issue without touching IE8.

IE8 will not be fixed.  Period.  End of story.  If you want a fix then upgrade or switch to a different OS (for a ton of new issues). 

5 hours ago, steve01 wrote

Once again 2 meaningless comments. Dont use canvas! Well actually in this case I dont use Canvas, its a hardware device that genarate a HTML5 page i embed in a iframe on this website. So there is nothing I can do.

Don't use that hardware device.

Your statement makes absoulutely no sense to ME.

As Microsoft did sell XP until 2-3 years ago and IE8 was released 2008 iirc?

So, customers are not likely to choose W7/IE9 when they cant log in to their bank pages to pay bills with the computer they bought 2 years ago. Do you change computer every year?

29 minutes ago, steve01 wrote

*snip*

But I dont like W7 and will continue to use XP Pro !

You're from Germany, right? Maybe you'll understand this then.

The owner of this vehicle:

probably doesn't think too much of this car:

There are many reasons to like the first one more than the second one (about 4.4 million reasons, actually), but the owner of the first one isn't demanding that Daimler continue making parts for his vehicle.

But you must be from either Poland or US right?

For quoting the offtopic part :

For you information, i can get parts to basically all old cars in US and UK.

But you must be from either Poland,US right?

Why would you assume that? Did I challenge your ability to write in Polish?

For quoting the offtopic part :

For you information, i can get parts to basically all old cars in US and UK.

And? Re-read what I posted.

And IE9/10 really need to change their Quirks Mode setting. Sites doesn't work on IE10 because they default to Quirks mode, like Citi bank and SkyDrive. I have to manually set it to IE9 mode, and it doesn't work on places when target=_blank.

54 minutes ago, steve01 wrote

As Microsoft did sell XP until 2-3 years ago and IE8 was released 2011 iirc?

Microsoft didn't sell XP then. OEMs did. If you have a problem with that, apply for a refund.

And IE8 was released in 2009. The fact that you are quoting this is precisely why Microsoft aren't pushing IE10 to XP. Because then you'll make stupid claims that XP should be supported for longer because Microsoft are releasing new programs for it.

XP / IE8 are old - and IE8 on XP has lots of features disabled because XP can't handle it (like low integrity processes and hardware acceleration).

You want to use shiny new bits of the web? Get a new OS, or get a different browser.

Let's not bother debating whether it's the correct decision - it's what the decision is. It's not going to change.

Why? I only have to look on the pictures to "get the picture" !

Your compare a car made 30 years ago vs a New car with some boring text.

And IE8 was released 2009 (how time flys by) and there was a major IE8 update

May 27,2010 (8.0.6001.18702IC SP2)

Hence , wtf are you meaning with this comparacy?

FACT : Ordinary ppl dont change computers that often as you in here do.

1 example:

I have one customer that have a brand new Volvo and the Second car is a 5 year old BMW. He is using Windows XP Home Edition with a P4 3GHZ i sold 5 years ago. He has no plan to upgrade his computer (as he think its rather new) but he call me all the time on IE8 bugs. I will guide him in here to continue this meaningless thread.

I think that's irresponsible. XP is still a large platform. It is as if you are saying SQL Server, Office, PhotoShop, Call of Duty shouldn't support XP anymore. And evidentally IE is losing relevence in Web because of this. You cannot expect IE to display a website properly because you CANNOT update it on """MAJOR!!!"" OS.

And this is definitly not a good way to motivate others to switch to other OS. Well, yeeah, it kind of is. They switch to FF/Chrome and realize they can do the same on iOS. So, there is less reasons to keep them in Windows world.

5 minutes ago, steve01 wrote

@cbae

Why? I only have to look on the pictures to "get the picture" !

No, you didn't get it. You said you can continue getting parts for old cars. So what? Getting parts recycled from totaled vehicles is not quite the same thing as buying genuine parts from the original manufacturer.

Neither is buying parts from third-party manufacturers. Sure, you might be able to get parts made by third parties at some surplus auto parts store for a 1955 300SL, but that's the equivalent of installing FireFox, Chrome, Opera, etc. on XP. What you're doing is the equivalent of asking Daimler to start producing parts again for that 300SL.

"I hate you XP users. I am not going to let you enjoy the next gen Web. I am not your friend. Google is your friend."

Such message is hurtful. Sigh, talking about hurtful, I think of my own life problem. Should have stay off this place. Tears....

Google is ur friend or worst enemy!

I should also had stayed away from here. But since Microsoft support did asked me to post this here, they can only blame themself for the many hits this thread will get in the future.

Its "TOP 10" on a google search now with keywords "XP HTML5" ... ohoh..

Maybe microsoft should add this metatag on channel9 forums.

<meta name="robots" content="noindex, nofollow, noarchive" />

Good i did use Tor-ip on all my postings.. 

57 minutes ago, magicalclick wrote

@evildictaitor:

I think that's irresponsible. XP is still a large platform. It is as if you are saying SQL Server, Office, PhotoShop, Call of Duty shouldn't support XP anymore. And evidentally IE is losing relevence in Web because of this. You cannot expect IE to display a website properly because you CANNOT update it on """MAJOR!!!"" OS.

Modern games already don't run on old hardware and old OSes, and Photoshop isn't Microsoft's concern. Microsoft's official policy is to not push new software like Office and IE to old OSes.

And this is definitly not a good way to motivate others to switch to other OS. Well, yeeah, it kind of is. They switch to FF/Chrome and realize they can do the same on iOS. So, there is less reasons to keep them in Windows world.

They're not in the Windows world if they're not giving Microsoft money by upgrading. Microsoft has long since stopped caring about customers on XP.

-space-

-space-

-space-

-space-

-space

-space

-space

Yes, confirmed that this bug is gone.

10-4 , Confirmed in my *old* IE8.  Well done Geoff.

/ Stoneage-Steve | I will go down with this ship (XP FTW)

48 minutes ago, evildictaitor wrote

Okay..... thank you for sharing stone cold MS company policy. It certainly is very insightful.

25 minutes ago, magicalclick wrote

*snip*

Okay..... thank you for sharing stone cold MS company policy. It certainly is very insightful.

Developing a new IE for XP brings in absolutely zero cash (in fact, it probably takes some away from people who might upgrade otherwise) and yet costs real money. People who bought XP have recieved a stonking 10+ years of free upgrades and fixes - that's pretty much unprecedented in the world of computing (especially when you consider that SP2 was pretty much a totally new OS release).

Sooner or later it becomes necessary for those consumers to pay back into the ecosystem by purchasing a new version, rather than just continually expecting something for nothing. The developers of websites, in this particular case, have decided that it is uneconomic for them to produce IE8 compatible websites and thus they, not Microsoft, are the ones who have determined that the segment of the market unprepared to upgrade their browser are not economically viable to support.

True. I don't even see the value of IE at all, except Win98 desktop, Vista Gadget, and Win8 Metro. It makes more sense to use Netscape/FF/Chrome, they are free anyway. If not for  having easy browser inside WinForm, WPF, and WinRT, there is really no point to allocate resources to compete with other free browsers.

Big companies (and governments) that pay millions of dollars for contractors to build internal web-sites get really pissed off when the website breaks because Google or Mozilla pushed out an update that had a minor but breaking change in the graphics engine.

These websites might be relying on ActiveX controls and pixel-perfect positioning based on entirely broken HTML that was made six years ago, but you'll be damned if you can find a CEO that understands that and agrees that the website needs a $100,000 makeover just to make the website look the same as it does now with no feature improvements.

This is why all big companies use Internet Explorer. IE does not change how it renders pages except at major version changes. And as an IT-administrator you get to test it across your enterprise and choose when to deploy that major change.

8 hours ago, Geoffreyk wrote

FWIW, the bug that was mentioned many pages ago has been fixed.

Yes, confirmed that this bug is gone.

Not for me it hasn't... just morphed into a different bug.

Now the edit box simply expands as the text overflows, instead of implementing scrollbars as required.

10 hours ago, evildictaitor wrote

@magicalclick: One word: Enterprise.

Big companies (and governments) that pay millions of dollars for contractors to build internal web-sites get really pissed off when the website breaks because Google or Mozilla pushed out an update that had a minor but breaking change in the graphics engine.

These websites might be relying on ActiveX controls and pixel-perfect positioning based on entirely broken HTML that was made six years ago, but you'll be damned if you can find a CEO that understands that and agrees that the website needs a $100,000 makeover just to make the website look the same as it does now with no feature improvements.

This is why all big companies use Internet Explorer. IE does not change how it renders pages except at major version changes. And as an IT-administrator you get to test it across your enterprise and choose when to deploy that major change.

This has been hashed so many times before. 

A thing like that is not a website and should not be called a website! And these developers/managers are holding it wrong (actually held, since I don't believe there are people like that today).

EDIT: So, we agree basically, but my take is that the rug should be pulled from under them, their projects are not websites.

The device is completely new product, there is no new firmware yet. But i did buy it for quite a lot of $. So i will live with the problems as you cant do own template html-files. I see little meaning in your post, 99.999999% of buyers of such product (me aswell) know all the things you mention. It was a surprised that i couldnt make own html templates though. I should have RTFM , but never the less i would had bought it. XP/IE8 user need to go away anyway, right?

8 hours ago, elmer wrote

*snip*

Not for me it hasn't... just morphed into a different bug.

Now the edit box simply expands as the text overflows, instead of implementing scrollbars as required.

I saw that briefly when I was testing, but I wasn't able to get it to repro again.

Without a repro, I am thinking it is a caching problem, or a loading sequence problem with tinyMCE.

Try reloading the page while holding down the ctrl key and see if it is still happening.

I am posting with IE8 right now, and it can work correctly.

-edit-

But when editing, the initial display does not expand correctly. I am thinking that there is some sort of problem with the current release of tinyMCE. They have just made a major update and may not have all of the bugs worked out.

Thanks

2 days ago, fanbaby wrote

...these developers/managers are holding it wrong...

...the rug should be pulled from under them....

There are a lot of big organisations with big internal websites that were made in the early 00s. Indeed governments (and there are lots of them) that routinely put out invitations to tender that specifically mention that the site must work under IE6/XP but no mention of other browsers.

You can just pull the rug out from under them, but let's not forget that Microsoft makes most of its money from corporate customers, not from end-users. Pissing your customers off isn't a good way of making money.

2 days ago, steve01 wrote

XP/IE8 user need to go away anyway, right?

We agree.(Yes, I do detect a hint of sarcasm) [Edit: Oops, bad click on my part]

I don't think I would knowingly buy a product that I knew my customers would be unable to use unless I had plans to get them off of XP/IE8. To forge ahead anyway seems like a very bad idea.

6 hours ago, evildictaitor wrote

*snip*

There are a lot of big organisations with big internal websites that were made in the early 00s. Indeed governments (and there are lots of them) that routinely put out invitations to tender that specifically mention that the site must work under IE6/XP but no mention of other browsers.

You can just pull the rug out from under them, but let's not forget that Microsoft makes most of its money from corporate customers, not from end-users. Pissing your customers off isn't a good way of making money.

I kinda understand that, but the problem as I see it started when someone promised backward compatibility. That's nice and all, and it made Microsoft what it is, but that's not the web. The web has no allegiance to no st!nk!ng backward compatibility. Its only allegiance is to standards. Yeah, I know they are shitty and suck (so say Silverlight disciples) but they are mine! And yours. ANd they are all we got.

The web. No entrance for:

1) Backward compatibility seekers. Just use a native Microsoft app already.

2) Lost pixel seekers. Use fncken PDF.

The two of you, I hate you  

jQuery 1.9  will be the last version to support so-called 'legacy' IE

I did say i didnt RTFM, and i do now have written a HTML4.01 page presenting the same things for the IE8 users. 

@elmer

from JQuery's blog:

Why is the jQuery core team dropping support for oldIE (IE 6/7/8)? We're not! jQuery 1.9 will support oldIE when it's released next year. The jQuery team will continue to support and maintain version 1.9 even after jQuery 2.0 is released.

How long will you support jQuery 1.9? As long as oldIE is a significant factor on the web.

Even the old JQuery versions works real fine that problably most sites will use for years to come.

As I said:  "jQuery 1.9  will be the last version to support so-called 'legacy' IE"

At the 1.9/2.0 branch, the functionality will be the same, and 1.9 will be maintained for bug-fixes.

However, from that point onwards (version >= 2) jQuery will NOT support legacy IE and this means that future development on jQuery will not support IE6/7/8

What they are saying is, that if you need Legacy IE support, you can continue to use versions up to 1.9, but that all development beyond that point will be without IE6/7/8 support.

Herbie