What in the world is wrong with this guy?

1 day ago, AndyC wrote

*snip*

Vista Starter - No DVD codec

Vista Home Basic - No DVD codec

Vista Home Premium - DVD codec included

Vista Business - No DVD codec

Vista Enterprise - No DVD codec

Vista Ultimate - DVD codec included

 

So that's 4 SKUs without a DVD codec and 2 with. Unless Math changed last I looked 4 is bigger than 2, so most Vista SKUs shipped without DVD codecs. Do you understand yet? Do I need to use shorter words?

 

Actually Microsoft DID provide DVD codecs for Vista Starter, Home Basic and Business if the OEM licensed it that way. So Vista would have played DVDs out of the box for almost all home users.

Sinofsky wrote:

 OEMs (PC manufacturers) had the option to license Windows Vista Starter, Home Basic, and Business "with DVD" where we offered a version that includes the Dolby Digital codec to enable the OS to support DVD playback for a nominal price increase.

 Why they can't do this for Win 8 is beyond me.

wrt. enterprise: If you're in an enterprise and you need to play DVDs your IT department should already have ensured you have the correct software/hardware. (Not saying that giving the IT guys extra work to do is a good thing, or that this is an ideal situation, but that it shouldn't impact the end user.) 

3 hours ago, GoddersUK wrote

Why they can't do this for Win 8 is beyond me.

Actually OEMs can (and many will) bundle DVD playing software. The announcement was that the shrink wrapped Windows8 won't (you can still search for "DVD player" in the AppStore if it worries you).

4 hours ago, DeathByVisualStudio wrote

*snip*

Fixed that for you.

That's how business works. Or are you annoyed that Microsoft isn't a monopoly any more and needs to be price-competitive with it's rivals?

@evildictaitor: Price-competitive? You're assuming they'll drop the price...

Windows 8! On sale now for $147.95! You save $2.00!

Oh thank you EvilD! You're my hero! Now all the little children can afford Windows... Hurray!

13 minutes ago, DeathByVisualStudio wrote

@evildictaitor: Price-competitive? You're assuming they'll drop the price...

I'm not sure whether you're just trolling or whether you're actually retarded. This is how business works. Pushing down supply-chain costs gives you the flexibility to push down prices for consumers.

DVD codecs are part of the supply-chain cost of producing Windows. This is money that Microsoft are not taking home in profits or being able to pass along as cost-savings to consumers.

By reducing the supply-chain cost of Windows, they have the opportunity to sell Windows for less or make more money per unit sold of Windows (which in turn gets reinvested in the business).

$5 per unit sold of Windows7 is $2 billion. Microsoft can either spend that money on research, improvements to products and price-competitiveness for Microsoft software (such as subsiding Xbox, since that division lost money last year) and return to investors, or they can blow it all as a massive annual pay check for DVD codecs that the vast majority of end-users don't need to have bundled with Windows.

Most users don't play DVDs on Windows. They play DVDs on DVD-players and if they watch movies on their laptop/desktop/tablet, they mostly do it with Internet-TV services like Netflix, Hulu and YouTube.

But if you really really really want to play DVDs in Windows8? Well install the Windows Media Center update via the Add Features to Windows 8 control panel. This will bring back all the DVD codecs you know and love and you only pay for it if you need it (rather than having no choice).

28 minutes ago, evildictaitor wrote

*snip*

or make more money per unit sold of Windows (which in turn gets reinvested in the business).

There you go! Now that wasn't so hard now was it? Let me help you with the last bit "which in turn gets reinvested in the business or gets piled up in a great big cash horde just like Apple." After all they are doing such a great job these days channeling Apple... ohmmmmmm...

But if you really really really want to play DVDs in Windows8? Well install the Windows Media Center update via the Add Features to Windows 8 control panel. This will bring back all the DVD codecs you know and love and you only pay for it if you need it (rather than having no choice).

Windows Media Center? In a corporate environment? What do you want people to think? I'm watching TV (or pr0n as someone else suggested)? Would be nice if they would have left the hooks in Windows Media Player for DVD playback. Too bad Sinofsky decided to help the world out by adding yet another little cut to the thousands that he's added already. No Comprimises!

1 hour ago, DeathByVisualStudio wrote

Windows Media Center? In a corporate environment?

If your company needs it they can pay for it and push it out via group policy.

Too bad Sinofsky decided to help the world out

Seems to me you're just determined to find fault with everything the Windows team does.

Trying to keep costs low? OUTRAGE! Trying to keep up with competitors? OUTRAGE! Trying to make Windows relevant to user's changing how they interact with technology? OUTRAGE!

But then again, maybe you're try type of person who goes into Subway and orders a $50 sandwich with "one of each filling" and then spends ten minutes removing the fillings you didn't actually want afterwards, rather than just paying for what you wanted in the first place.

Because, you know, Microsoft are evil for providing choice where you get to pick, choose and pay for only the features you want.

@evildictaitor: Oh EvilD, you know WMC != WMP. Silly rabbit Trix are for kids.

I'm done playing with you on this thread. You are welcome to continue to defend Microsoft's foolishness all you want. Birds of a feather...

32 minutes ago, DeathByVisualStudio wrote

@evildictaitor: Oh EvilD, you know WMC != WMP.

DVD codecs are codecs (the clue is in the name) and aren't in WMC or WMP, but in the Windows codec store and shared by everything that use of Direct Show like WMC and WMP.

But then that doesn't help your argument, so I presume you'll just reply with more OUTRAGE!

Enjoy your sandwich.

23 minutes ago, evildictaitor wrote

*snip*

DVD codecs are codecs (the clue is in the name) and aren't in WMC or WMP, but in the Windows codec store and shared by everything that use of Direct Show like WMC and WMP.

But then that doesn't help your argument, so I presume you'll just reply with more OUTRAGE!

No outrage, just facts. Funny it comes from your beloved master:

Why doesn't Windows Media Player support DVD playback even after installing Media Center? Based on the above discussion, it should be clear that we cannot enable DVD playback all the time in Windows Media Player.  Given the ongoing feedback to avoid feature overlap and to avoid the complexity of behavior changing for a previously installed component, we only enable DVD playback in Media Center once it is installed. 

Source: http://blogs.msdn.com/b/b8/archive/2012/05/04/q-amp-a-dvd-playback-and-windows-media-center-in-windows-8.aspx

Oh EvilD you're just too easy...

1 hour ago, DeathByVisualStudio wrote

OUTRAGE!!!OUTRAGE!!!OUTRAGE!!!OUTRAGE!!!OUTRAGE!!!OUTRAGE!!!OUTRAGE!!!

In that case they've completely redesigned WMC and WMP since Win7.

Even so, I don't really care. I still use VLC because WMP and WMC suck and I don't watch DVDs.

Sucks to be you DBVS. Enjoy your sandwich.

Like I said above, if these cuts mean MS will actually make Windows 8 an attractive upgrade, i.e. <$50, then I'm all for it. If it means that it will be $115 instead of $120, it's a dumb move that will only frustrate users.

8 hours ago, evildictaitor wrote

*snip*

Actually OEMs can (and many will) bundle DVD playing software. The announcement was that the shrink wrapped Windows8 won't (you can still search for "DVD player" in the AppStore if it worries you).

Read it properly. It wasn't about OEMs bundling PoweDVD, it was about OEMs licensing a version of a Windows SKU that didn't usually include the DVD codecs with the codecs. Why they can't says something similar to OEMs with Win8 is beyond me:

"If you're selling a PC with a DVD drive pay an extra $2 and we'll include the DVD codecs with Windows".

Yes, by bundling third party software OEM sold machines will still play DVDs, but I don't see how that's better than paying $2 extra for it to be included in Windows. That's just more software to confuse people, go wrong, get out of date and be sub-par.

And I'm really not sure the saved $2 is likely to result in a cheaper OS. At best it will result in the inclusion or development of something else. And if Windows is $2 cheaper than it would be otherwise that kind of figure is so low wrt. the cost of a PC that it will just get lost in all the other costs and line the pockets of Dell/HP/Sony etc. when people buy preinstalled PCs (i.e how "normal users" get their copies of Windows).

Windows should play DVD's by default, it's a feature I expect from my OS, period.

What's next?

Graphics support only when the first display is connected to the device, for a nominal fee of $5,-.

You want to store stuff to your USB? $5,- plugin. Because, you know, not everyone uses USB.

Do you want to use a mouse? $5,-

Keyboard? $3,-

Harddisk? $5,- per harddisk

I will eventually end up with an OS costing me $500,-.

(I will pay for WMC, just because I love it!)

@Maddus Mattus:

"There is an app for that"

It is slippery slop, but, to be honest, I am on the same slop as you.

I am ok with extra app for WMC, but, no DVD playback in WMP just feel sad. You know, it is like buying a Proche and realize they didn't include a 2 dollar cup holder. Of course I can send it to a body shop and install the cup holder, but, it just feel sad that I have to do it.

4 hours ago, GoddersUK wrote

but I don't see how that's better than paying $2 extra for it to be included in Windows. 

Because if you're selling a low-end machine that doesn't have a DVD drive, you can now sell it cheaper.

4 hours ago, Maddus Mattus wrote

You want to store stuff to your USB? $5,- plugin. Because, you know, not everyone uses USB.

Do you want to use a mouse? $5,-

Keyboard? $3,-

Harddisk? $5,- per harddisk

I will eventually end up with an OS costing me $500,-.

(I will pay for WMC, just because I love it!)

Most licences in Windows are fractions of a cent per unit sold. DVD codecs are multiple dollars per unit sold.

So it's like saying "I have to pay extra for my sandwich to come bundled with a $50 steak!? What next? Having to pay 0.2c for margarine?"

If you want the steak, pay for it separately. The margarine is cheap and comes free with the sandwich.