Media Player is old, but is 70 % Finger friendly.

In Windows 8 i want Zune software but finger friendly. Team PLS FIX UX

3 hours ago,sushovan wrote

I think this is a great suggestion. However there are some things that Media Player can do, but zune can't. (equalizer, frame by frame, play speed settings, media player plugins for lyrics etc). There might be issues with completely ditching media player. But I would really like to see it happen. Add those features to Zune, and ditch media player!

Media Player is actually just showcase for DirectShow's (and Media Foundation's) capabilities. If there's anything MP can do, then WMC and Zune can do it too, just with a few minor UI modifications.

The thing is, the Zune software and WMP have a lot of overlap, but they also have reasons to exist: Microsoft cannot put online store or first-party device integration into WMP without breaking the "pure" user experience, and WMP lacks the "zune design sense" necessary to make the Zune product seem like a first-rate competitor to the iPod.

That said, if I was in charge of WMP and Zune, I would build a new product that that really extensible and skinnable. I would ship the product as WMP, but the Zune team can make use of the extensibility and skinning engine to transform the product into "WMP + Zune", thus problem solved.

Of course the optiion exists for third-parties to do the same, but as we all know, they would never do that

27 minutes ago,IDWMaster wrote

Just like MSN explorer vs Internet Explorer. 

MSN Explorer was a joke, but it did have its users (including my own 12 year-old self in 2001). It exist as a means to sell MSN Premium subscriptions, but I used it because it was a very nice alternative client to MSN Messenger (the UI was very pretty, whereas at the time Messenger version 3 was gunmetal grey), and it also had a nice hotmail UI and download manager, so it wasn't totally useless.

Agreed. Need a finger friendly Zune Software.

Or just wait for WinPh7 tablet.

This is really a problem since you cant sync files to your phone by simply dropping them into zune, nooo, you have to browse to them inside zune!

Both zune and media player needs to go away and be replaced by something that isnt tied to windows and isnt tied to some obsolete hardware.. maybe an addition to the live suite that integrates with the device stage?

It's like the old Netscape all over again with Zune. It does a whole bunch of stuff, but it does not do one thing well,..

I have tagged my Kung Fu Pannda on Zune. I am not sure what you mean by no tagging.

18 minutes ago,Bas wrote

I just want the Media Player team to be replaced by a team that A) isn't invisible and B) knows what the hell they are doing. If I get that stupid "Could not connect to server" message again after waiting for five minutes when double clicking a video on my desktop, I'm going to punch a small child in the face.

It's now been over 12 years since we've had active/live scrubbing in Quicktime player for Windows.

WMP12 still uses the old "Video for Windows 3.11"-style scrubbing.

YouTube, Vimeo, iOS, all support active scrubbing.

Why, Microsoft, WHY?!?

and a better WMP = more EU law suits. WMP still works very well IMO.

@aL_:

Not sure if one for WL Essential is good. It does solved EU law suits problems, however, you would end up with a Windows that couldn't play video by default; worse than Win95. Email is fine because most of them use web version anyway.

Anyway, I think it is more obvious that WMP would stay as player. It plays media. It doesn't do other Zune stuff to keep law suits away. And Zune software certainly need WP7 like interface to keep it finger friendly, and need a more consistant Sync interface.

18 minutes ago,magicalclick wrote

@Bas:

and a better WMP = more EU law suits. WMP still works very well IMO.

The EU lawsuits weren't about the quality of WMP.

7 hours ago,Bas wrote

*snip*

The EU lawsuits weren't about the quality of WMP.

you are correct, but, you don't see law suit with Paint from other competitors.

3 hours ago,magicalclick wrote

*snip*

you are correct, but, you don't see law suit with Paint from other competitors.

To be fair, you have a point. Adobe did raise a right fuss over the inclusion of PDF generation support in Microsoft office (and thus eliminating 90% of the reasons to actually pay for Adobe Acrobat; but it was going to happen anyway, free PDF-generating virtual printers have existed for a while now).

However it isn't like Microsoft has a monopoly on media playing/library-management software (I'd argue iTunes has more regular users than WMP) and improving the baseline only makes everything better for everyone (except lazy third-party developers).

You only get sued if you abuse your monopoly position to push out the competition, such is what happened with the bundling of IE with Windows when Netscape and other browsers cost money to buy at the time.

No-one really pays for music management software anymore: iTunes is free, MusicMatch was free, RealJukebox (is it still around?) was free. I can't really think of anything Microsoft could do to WMP (that wasn't absolutely braindead, like removing MP3 ripping support) that would be congruent with monopoly abuse.

4 minutes ago,W3bbo wrote

*snip*

I can't really think of anything Microsoft could do to WMP (that wasn't absolutely braindead, like removing MP3 ripping support) that would be congruent with monopoly abuse.

Adding, for example, Zune functionality allowing you to buy music online and sync with a Windows Phone 7 device could easily be construed as leveraging Windows on the PC to gain marketshare in the phone and music space. It's probably harder to think of features you could add to WMP that wouldn't raise an eyebrow than it is the other way around.

I thought itune is a separate download from Mac os DVDs. Does anyone who installed Mac os , not buying a Mac from the store, can comform this for me? 

Anyway, the reality is, when you do better than competitors and it come with os for free, you get law suits. One reason they didn't include Paint .NET in Vista or win7. You can spin it all you like, but, that's the reality.

huhu, that's true. I rememeber they pushed one update that froze when saving JPEG, then, the next update fixed it. Stuff like this would be horrible if it goes with OS update cycles.

The thing is they probably could offer a stable version of Paint .Net to MS. And will have a seperate version of their own. Like how ICE is a seperate project before it is finalized into WL Photo Gallery. Some ICE features like video stiching is still not presented in WL Photo Gallery.

This also get me thinking. WL Essenstial should have new Paint software that support layering, history list, and so on.

1 day ago,aL_ wrote

My beef with zune is not the media playing itself by the media browsing.. no list view for videos? Why can i only show huge thumbnails that block out part of the file name? Why is there not even a tool tip for displaying the entire filename?

It's funny cause the entire iTunes Music Store is like this and it pisses me off. Virtually every title on the iTunes store is truncated with "..." attached to the end. Nearly everything needs to be clicked on and drilled into before you can see the whole title -- and that's a horrible experience when you combine it with the fact that no matter how powerful your computer is, iTunes (and it's embedded store web page) on Windows acts as if it's on a 386SX-33 w/4MB of RAM.

1 day ago,aL_ wrote

My beef with zune is not the media playing itself by the media browsing.. no list view for videos? Why can i only show huge thumbnails that block out part of the file name? Why is there not even a tool tip for displaying the entire filename?

*snipped*

If you hover your mouse pointer over the title (as opposed to the image), you do get a tool tip for the entire title.

Make something new, include it with the Live Essentials suite. Windows Live Media Player, or Windows Live Media, something like that.

I'm also hoping they keep updating Media Center. I use it every day on my HTPC. I heard a rumor that they're dropping it from Windows 8.

iTunes is the worst for tagging, since things like album covers don't get injected into the mp3 like it should, just the iTunes library gets updated with the cover.

All were developed at different times for different purposes, I know, but you have to marvel at the simplicity of the Apple model: Iphone or ipod or mini or nano or mac + itunes and your're done.  Why/how has Microsoft got itself into yet another multi-application support nightmare?  You would have thought they would have learned the lessons of 9x/NT merger.

Windows 8 must solve these issues from the start.  I don't think that adding WMP to the Windows Live family is a good idea - the Windows Live brand is congested and confusing enough and what a horrible mouthful - Windows Live Media Player - urrrgh!  If Zune is to be the media player poster child for Windows 8, (which I think it should be), then it needs to be included with Windows 8 not a separate download.

1 hour ago,indigo_7 wrote

All were developed at different times for different purposes, I know, but you have to marvel at the simplicity of the Apple model: Iphone or ipod or mini or nano or mac + itunes and your're done. 

And FrontRow (sadly gone in Lion). And Quicktime Player.

But yeah, it's very simple to use iTunes on your TV with a remote.

I kinda agree. It would be cool to have a Zune that's:

• Lite, like WMP.
• Support Codec Pack, (I suppose Zune does this already, haven't tested it)
• Big Buttons like WMC
• Offers WMC channels. (I like to watch movie trailers on MSN chennels on WMC)

Probably not WMP upgrade because they attract law suits. Just do it on Zune which is optional. Although WMP would merge with WMC for a more consistant experience.

How did you tag it? i've been looking for a way to do that in zune for ages.. anyhow, i'd rather not retag thousends of videos just because zune cant show my folders...

as for WL esencials, it pops right up when you first install windows, and is preinstalled on pretty much all retail computers so i dont really see that as a problem. being outside the windows release cycle would also be a huge benefit and allow them to stay relevant alot more easily.

I doubled checked it, my bad. I only set the categories, so, it will show in the movie tab. Not really a tagging.

As for WL essentials. I really liked how they finally removed mail and photo gallery in Win7. But I am not sure about some of the stuff. Those things in WL essentials are not entirely essential. Win7 can view photos just fine and most people check email on web. But, when it comes to WMP, I wanted it to be build-in. Maybe that's my old way of thinking. It just doesn't feel right. I am actually more than happy to have WMP separated to avoid law suits and really able to evolve freely. But, it just doesn't feel right. 

[edit] LOLZ, talking about WL essentials, I just got an update within a minute.

18 hours ago,PaoloM wrote

*snip*

And FrontRow (sadly gone in Lion). And Quicktime Player.

But yeah, it's very simple to use iTunes on your TV with a remote.

ROFL ^_^

8 hours ago,aL_ wrote

@magicalclick:

How did you tag it? i've been looking for a way to do that in zune for ages.. anyhow, i'd rather not retag thousends of videos just because zune cant show my folders...

What exactly do you mean by "tagging"? Zune does allow you to add some metadata to your videos:

• Title
• Sort Title
• Category
• Genre
• Release Date
• Description

You can group/sort the videos by the following fields:

• Title/Sort Title
• Category (only from the "All" pivot)
• Content Type (DRM-Free vs Purchased--kinda useless)
• Date Added
• Genre (from anything other than the "All" pivot)

If you select "TV" as the category, you can add data to other fields:

• Series Title
• Season #
• Episode Title
• Episode #

 And you can group/sort by these fields from the "TV" pivot.

3 hours ago,cbae wrote

*snip*

What exactly do you mean by "tagging"? Zune does allow you to add some metadata to your videos:

• Title
• Sort Title
• Category
• Genre
• Release Date
• Description

You can group/sort the videos by the following fields:

• Title/Sort Title
• Category (only from the "All" pivot)
• Content Type (DRM-Free vs Purchased--kinda useless)
• Date Added
• Genre (from anything other than the "All" pivot)

If you select "TV" as the category, you can add data to other fields:

• Series Title
• Season #
• Episode Title
• Episode #

 And you can group/sort by these fields from the "TV" pivot.

I think he might be refering to the ability to change a file's metadata (as opposed to simply its entry in the media library).

I don't think video files like MPEG have support for things like ID3, unlike MP3.

38 minutes ago,W3bbo wrote

*snip*

I think he might be refering to the ability to change a file's metadata (as opposed to simply its entry in the media library).

I don't think video files like MPEG have support for things like ID3, unlike MP3.

Those changes are reflected into the files, when the format support is there. WMV, MP4 and most other H.264 containers allow plenty of metadata and those are pretty much everything you'll ever need on a computer.