full flash on metro....

http://www.engadget.com/2013/03/11/flash-coming-to-internet-explorer-10-on-windows-8-and-rt/

So flash is going to be open for all sites in Metro IE.

Ok cool.... what about silverlight??

i know i know beating a dead horse, but dang way to treat your customers Microsoft. 

Hey i got an idea, why not just put OSX on Surface, The cycle will be complete.

@wsdotnet: I find it hard to turn this positive development into something negative. Flash is used on thousands of old websites, while silverlight is on dozens. That sound you just heard, was the sound of a billion people yawning.

-Josh

15 minutes ago, wsdotnet wrote

i know i know beating a dead horse, but dang way to treat your customers Microsoft. 

By giving them what they want?

Also, most silverlight stuff would likely end up as Win8 apps anyway.

@JoshRoss: yeah, i hate to say it your right.

@MasterPie: i point was if they can give us flash, just throw in silverlight and shut people like me up.

@MasterPie: btw, windows 8 needs all the help it can get. 

@wsdotnet: There's nothing to say that they won't. It's all about priorities, and Flash has a bigger footprint.

My guess is that this isn't so much them having listened to customers, as it is that they needed time to make it happen. Since Flash is implemented natively in the browser, there's probably been a lot of code-review to make sure that it's going to be solid.

This is great news. I've said from the beginning they needed to include full flash to one-up iOS. Too many sites still use it and no amount of pressure from Google, Apple, Adobe nor Microsoft seems to have put much of a dent in it.

8 minutes ago, kettch wrote

*snip*

My guess is that this isn't so much them having listened to customers, as it is that they needed time to make it happen. Since Flash is implemented natively in the browser, there's probably been a lot of code-review to make sure that it's going to be solid.

Yeah nothing like releasing a beta as production... 

31 minutes ago, DeathBy​VisualStudio wrote

*snip*

Yeah nothing like releasing a beta as production... 

Yeah, and that's why we get into situations where "Vista was fine after service pack 1" .. but the thing is, no one cared and they waited for 7 because to them, "Vista sucked" because it came out of the box that way on computers that shouldn't have had a "made for Vista" sticker on them and selling "upgrade" retail boxes as if there were XP computers at the time capable of running it.

It's as if first impressions are not even a consideration when selling a product as well as the apparent belief that the general consumer nowadays will put up with the same crap computer geeks put up with ten years ago -- e.g. unfinished products being sold to them.

It is the most misunderstood aspect of consumers of Apple products -- they don't buy them because they're sheep, they buy them because they appear and function like a finished product on the day they're released.

But back on topic -- I'm happy about Flash being included, as long as I can turn it off too. I whitelist flash-enabled sites in Chrome, so I only get Flash in browser when I deem it necessary.

1 hour ago, kettch wrote

Since Flash is implemented natively in the browser, there's probably been a lot of code-review to make sure that it's going to be solid.

Lol. Nearly spat out my coffee.

Yeah nothing like releasing a beta as production...

Wait, what? How is "Not releasing something before it is solid" the same thing as "Releasing a beta as production"? How do betas work over there? 

7 hours ago, Craig_​Matthews wrote

*snip*

Yeah, and that's why we get into situations where "Vista was fine after service pack 1" .. but the thing is, no one cared and they waited for 7 because to them, "Vista sucked" because it came out of the box that way on computers that shouldn't have had a "made for Vista" sticker on them and selling "upgrade" retail boxes as if there were XP computers at the time capable of running it.

It's as if first impressions are not even a consideration when selling a product as well as the apparent belief that the general consumer nowadays will put up with the same crap computer geeks put up with ten years ago -- e.g. unfinished products being sold to them.

It is the most misunderstood aspect of consumers of Apple products -- they don't buy them because they're sheep, they buy them because they appear and function like a finished product on the day they're released.

Yes, because Apple doesn't release updates for their desktop OS every year and has never released buggy unfinished crap to consumers.

On topic: the whitelist was dumb and this change is good. Silverlight support would be nice but Flash support is far more essential. The blog post sums it up reasonably well:

As a practical matter, the primary device you walk around with should give you access to all the Web content on the sites you rely on. Otherwise, the device is just a companion to a PC.

If they can keep focussing on this, removing (seemingly) arbitrary WinRT/Metro restrictions as they go, things ought to start looking good for Windows.

@evildictaitor: I was halfway serious about that.

http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2012/05/windows-8-will-integrate-include-adobe-flash/

Wonder if this also means the WebView object will also support it...

6 hours ago, kettch wrote

@evildictaitor: I was halfway serious about that.

http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2012/05/windows-8-will-integrate-include-adobe-flash/

Just because Microsoft is shipping flash doesn't mean that they get to code-review it. Adobe is just as crappy as it was before, just this time it comes with your machine by default.

@evildictaitor: Microsoft has been teaching Adobe how to use the SDL, which is a big deal. Also, I can't imagine that they'd import Adobe's libraries and exempt them from the normal testing process that the rest of IE's code goes through.

1 day ago, DeathBy​VisualStudio wrote

Yeah nothing like releasing a beta as production... 

On a related note this opinion piece from LiveSide makes for an interesting read: http://www.liveside.net/2013/02/27/windows-phone-7-8-delayed-from-beta-tester-to-guinea-pig/

14 hours ago, evildictait​or wrote

*snip*

Just because Microsoft is shipping flash doesn't mean that they get to code-review it. Adobe is just as crappy as it was before, just this time it comes with your machine by default.

I was thinking about flash, and all it's done for the web. And then I realised - for all it's problems, crappiness, security holes and so forth there's one redeeming feature that just about compensates. One thing that makes it all OK:

It's not Real Player.

2 hours ago, GoddersUK wrote

*snip*

I was thinking about flash, and all it's done to the web.

FTFY

It's not Real Player.

+1

1 day ago, Craig_​Matthews wrote

It is the most misunderstood aspect of consumers of Apple products -- they don't buy them because they're sheep, they buy them because they appear and function like a finished product on the day they're released.

Wow, talk about revisionist history... forgot how the first TWO releases of OSX couldn't even play a DVD? How the iPhone's app story for a full year was "write a web page"?