A better question would be - what compelling reason did average people have for paying for / trying Vista?littleguru said:jamie said:*snip*How many of them actually tried Vista? Seriously. I got so many people saying Vista sucked and they NEVER tried it.
Discussions
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jonathansampson said:
In America the Church (501(c)(3)) has very little influence (or, they are suppose to according to the law). All they can say is "Get out and Vote," which is what Churches in my area did. The local news covered many Black pastors who were leading their congregations to the polls rather than church in these last few weeks. Technically, the church isn't supposed to endorse/condemn a particular candidate - but some of them get away with it. For example, as the news interviewed one predominantly black church in my county the pastor talked about the importance of voting, and made it very clear that he was not telling his congregation who to vote for. It all sounded very good, save for the fact he had a giant Obama face on his shirt (clearly a silent suggestion). In this election, Black Churches in Florida silently united in support for Obama. But we've seen this in past years for other candidates too. The Church finds ways to influence elections, which I don't see as a bad thing. If you're going to have a democracy, have a democracy.GoddersUK said:*snip*
Two things here, Jon. I remembered something I saw and thought you'd appreciate it. I'd put it up before heading out.
1) I agree with you (!) about churches supporting candidates. They should bite the bullet, ignore tax breaks, and not be restricted in what they say. I'd step up with my giving if my church did that.
2) You asked for logical intelligent reasons for backing Obama.. Would you accept a conservative Evangelical's reasoning for voting Obama? Here's the blog posting. I think the pro-life position is very interesting. http://digitalscriptorium.info/digital_scriptorium/2008/11/election-day.html
Enjoy!
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Dr Herbie said:
One -- don't keep saying 'you know that' in posts, it's really annoying. I do NOT 'know' that all opinions don't carry equal weight; isn't the 'all men are equal' phrase something that's supposed to be important in your country (I'm not American, so the constitution is not one of my strong points)? I prefer not to judge the validity of someone elses opinion unless there is considerable evidence to do so, so I don't 'know' that at all. I give equal weight to my political opinions as I do to the postman who lives next door; who am I to judge whether the foundations for his opinion are better or worse than mine?jonathansampson said:*snip*
Bas DID give the foundation for his opinion -- "graduating magna cum laude in law from Harvard, an eleven year career in law focusing on civil rights and economic developmeent", etc. But you chose to ignore that.
I agree with littleguru's statement: you don't seem to treat these 'discussions' as anything other that an effort to re-enforce the optinions you started with, which is why they always turn out to be pointless. And with that, I'm getting back to these Crystal Reports that I'm supposed to be altering.
Herbie
I concur with you and littleguru's observation: It sounds more like JSampson is looking for more people to bolster his own opinion, rather than actually listening to what people are saying.. Education and Intelligence are more than enough reason for vote someone into office. I feel no shame in desiring that the brightest people run our country. We all have seen what a C student at Yale can do. I think an A student at Harvard can do a better job. For those unfamiliar, a C student is "Average" and an "A" student is deemed "Excellent". I'd also add that a C average , in many universities, is barely above the requirement for being kicked out of a University.
Signing off - and really, everyone, make a list (see my earlier post) and hold yourself accountable for your vote!
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spivonious said:
The only qualifications for the job of President is that you're 35 or older and a natural-born citizen.jonathansampson said:*snip*
Disclaimer - I voted for Barr.Didn't Wayne Root kill off the election for Barr?
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I respect that you are someone who is hard against people who votes against Obama for the reasons you mentioned. But, I think one earlier poster (Bas?) gave a great rational, logical reason for their vote:jonathansampson said:
Jason,Jason I said:*snip*
I didn't start this thread to change peoples minds. It's too late for that - the damage has been done. I started this thread to ask WHY they voted the way they did in hopes to unearth some reason behind their actions. I've not seen anything that appears to be rational so far. I'm not here to persuade democrats to be republicans, or liberals to be conservatives. I'm only here asking why those who voted for Obama, did what they did in hopes of finding logic behind their actions.
I am just as hard against anybody who votes against obama because "He's a Muslim," or "He pals around with terrorists," or "He wasn't born in America." These are all stupid reasons, and I doubt I need to dissect them further for this audiences approval. I'm not on an anti-obama tirade here, I'm on search for intelligence behind what took place last night in America.
Jonathan
..... For me personally, graduating magna cum laude in law from Harvard, an eleven year career in law focusing on civil rights and economic developmeent, serving in state senate, and four years in the US senate, and presenting the sort of plans that he did during his campaign qualifies him as president. Again, that's just the qualifications I want someone to have if I'd have the power to make someone president. Everybody else's mileage will vary.
Your answer here, and one I'd agree with, is intelligence and education. While many people might shrug off college students, and yes, many of them are drunks: I went to school thrice..., many are not. And some people I know did love to party and were well thought-out intellgent people.. 15 years ago, I fit into that category.. Believing in someone with the above qualifications is more than enough to be.
So,perhaps the intelligence you seek is, well, intelligence..
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That's because no one on this earth is perfect. We're all wrong about something, and with politics being so big, it's only obvious that ALL of us, myself included, might be wrong about something in our respective ideologies.jonathansampson said:
Littleguru, why should you move in your position if you're convinced your position is right and true?littleguru said:*snip*
I'm sorry the thread is too big to read all of it, but if you are of the type that believes that they shouldn't change their political decision if they believe they are right and true, then why start this thread? Why ask why people would vote for the most inexperienced president if you aren't going to learn from it? If you already have made your decision?
Remember your history: if people's views on politics never changed, where would we be historically? Even in the late 70's and early 80's, the religious right decided that their views on politics HAD changed, in that it *is* ok for Christians to enter and be a part of politics. While some of their individual views on policies might not have changed, their entry into the political system WAS a political decision. Where would the parties be if those christian leaders took the position that they shouldn't change their political views?
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Can I make a suggestion to you, Jonathan? And everyone? I'm also doing this myself. I'd do this on a big software project, so why not with an even better project?
As a 'check' to make sure I'm voting for the right guy and why I'm not voting for the other candidate, I've made a list of *measurable* traits as to why I voted the way I did. Make it a good, verifiable. Did I say measurable?? Keep this list WRITTEN DOWN and in a safe place. And, in a few years, check back on it. See if the promises made were kept. And if not, why not? Here's some rules I'm following.
Don't say, "I didn't vote for Barack, because he supports abortion". Say, "I didn't vote for Barack, because under Barack, abortions will increase."
Don't say "I voted for Barack, because he supports gay rights." Say, "I'm supporting Barack, because he'll open SSN benefits to gay couples."
Don't say, "I voted for George Bush, because he doesn't like big government". Say, "I'm voting for George Bush, because he'll shrink the size of the federal government."
And, when reviewing your list in a few years, be sure to note WHY things might not have been done, and whether or that is reasonable. For example, you might have said in the year 2000, "I'm supporting George W. Bush because he will promote Mexican relations and help make Mexican workers legal." But, when reviewing in a few years, realize that 9/11 put an end to that campaign pledge.
I'm not saying this in a partisian way.. It's validating WHY you're voting the way you do. It's a way of measuring whether or not your fears are rational or not. It also lets you put your vote where your mouth is: if you're voting for "Change" (whatever that means to you), define it. And if that didn't get met, you change your vote in 2012.
Last comment: make your list public, to keep you accountable to your friends.
It's what I'm doing... -
Remember, jonathan, one of the biggest takeovers of Congress, back in 1994, was performed by the Republicans based upon the fact that 'real people' should be elected, instead of politicians. Bill Frist, a surgeon, is a great example of someone with little experience going to lead. Less experience was viewed as better than the establishment. If I recall correctly, Frist became the leader of the senate, although not right away.jonathansampson said:
You didn't give me any evidence of qualifying experience...I'm sincerely being honest here, I want to know what qualifies this man to be one of the most powerful leaders in the World. "He isn't W" is hardly enough. As a matter of fact, that type of argument is neutral, as it doesn't ensure he's any better, or any worse.evildictaitor said:*snip*
Please, what qualifies him?
I wouldn't call "the Ignorant" vote what won Obama. He won hands down with 30-something college educated whites. What, specifically, are they ignorant of? -
giovanni said:
Thanks, I see your point, but sooner or later I will buy a BD-ROM and I like to minimize the amount of stuff underneath my TV, so it is one or the other...daSmirnov said:*snip*I have been using my XBOX 360 as an extender for a long time. It works well, although I would make sure if you have a fast enough network to run video. If you have a wired network, you're fine most likely. If you have a wireless network - make sure you're using A or N network. G is ok, but A has less interference (I found..) and N works great if you have a bridge (the Xbox 360 Wireless card is not N compatible).
Also, spend the 20 bucks and get a Xbox 360 Wireless Media remote. It works great and will provide universal remote functionality for your TV.
Let us know how you like it! -
For those people interested in how Night-elves and Shamans are leaning this political season...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h5Kg-K7em20
