Discussions

@felix9: you don't see how the api's are being elevated into UserMode as something similar to what Drawbridge is doing ?

No one here is talking about ... "what if windows code were open source like Linux" ... then this would be a non issue as all code would be open/visible and clearly contribution can come from anyone and fixes/changes/enhancements will rise to the top based on there own merits..

I agree that what this so called junior, or other business unit dev did was wrong, but I also wished that MS were more open with their code bases! Would be great to see what the evolution of the kernel would be like if it were open

I would love if you could ask

1. Why did they choose the NUGET mechanism for the ImmutableCollections feature. Is this something we should expect going forward for other features from them

2. What made them choose using NUGET over VISUAL STUDIO EXTENSIONS.

3. What is the next step from this preview, or more importantly how do they envision the roadmap for these NUGET delivered features...

4. How do these features finally make there way into .NET framework?

5 hours ago, BitFlipper wrote

I'm not familiar with Redhawk but I assume you mean "Reverse P/Invoke"? If so, yes the .Net framework supports being called from C. Unfortunately this functionality is not plumbed all the way through to say, C#. Ideally there should be a "DllExport" attribute that allows a .Net assembly to have that method exported and be able to be called purely from C (while initializing the .Net framework during the 1st C call).

This is a primer to the fabled 'Redhawk'  ... its the future api of windows (or rather the base classes of windows)

http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/System-Language-Runtime-or-Project-Redhawk-surfaces-in-Windows-8

This is awesome stuff ... simply awesome!!!

@evildictaitor:  I found this other document that talks about the architecture of Singularity including background information on how they came up with those cycles calculations..

ftp://ftp.research.microsoft.com/pub/tr/TR-2005-135.pdf

Would love your input seeing as you know this stuff intimately (assuming you have time ofcourse as its 44 pages long)  BUT its a great read

Quote from the document

Singularity is a micro-kernel operating system that uses advances in programming languages and compilers to build lightweight, software-isolated processes, which provide code with protection and failure isolation at lower overhead than conventional, hardware supported processes. Singularity provides an isolation boundary by running verifiably safe programs and by preventing object pointers from passing between processes' object spaces.

SIPs, in turn, enable a new solution to the problem of code extension in systems and applications. In Singularity's model, extensions are not loaded into their parent process, but instead run in their own process and communicate over strongly typed channels. This model fixes some of the major problems with extensions, since in Singularity, they cannot directly access their parents' data or interfaces, and, if they fail, they can be easily terminated by killing their parents.

Singularity is above all a laboratory for exploring interactions among system architecture, programming languages, compilers, specification, and verification. Advances in each of these areas enable and reinforce advances in the others domains, which limits the benefit and impact of studying an area in isolation. Singularity is small and well structured, so it is possible to make changes that span the arbitrary boundaries between these domains. At the same time, it is large and realistic enough to demonstrate the practical advantages of new techniques.

Definetely sounds like evildicator knows his stuff, not questioning that. BUT I do agree with Joe Duffy as well with the overuse of split normally for massive dynamic strings and almost always with a collection of strings.. Lots of .NET devs, including myself, are very poor optimized programmers as Joe hints at..

Regardless I also know that Joe and his team is probably working on Midori and the SingularityOS project, that several millions of lines of managed code on a managed os.

Anyway I found some stats of Singularity, of how it improves across the board on certain OS system cycles ... Some of you may find it interesting :

http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/The-Singularity-Project-with-results

I found a nice Singularity paper that actually goes into some performance statistics..

Shows across the board Cycle reductions at the OS level for many systems within the SinguarlityOS.

I really want to see this Midori project's managed SingularityOS work (with dev platform) ... It really does sound exciting...

http://www.cs.rochester.edu/~sandhya/csc256/seminars/ryates_singularity.pdf

e.g. results

Software Isolated Process: Creation

============================

[Process create and start]

OS  - Cycles

Singularity - 353,000

freeBSD 5.3 - 1,030,000

Linux 2.6.11 (Red Hat FC4) - 719,000

Windows XP (SP2)  - 5,380,000

Software Isolated Process: Syscall

============================

[Minimum Kernel API Call]

OS - Cycles

Singularity - 91

freeBSD 5.3 - 878

Linux 2.6.11 (Red Hat FC4) - 437

Windows XP (SP2) - 627

etc. etc. (lots more stats in pdf above)

We know that his working on a managed code base, that's several millions of lines long of managed code ... that can beat the pants off any native programming environment ...

SHOW ME THIS "MANAGED" NIRVANA

http://www.bluebytesoftware.com/blog/2012/10/31/BewareTheString.aspx

From the Windows Phone team, they're starting to divuldge the architecture of WP

http://blogs.msdn.com/b/abhinaba/archive/2012/11/08/windows-phone-8-evolution-of-the-runtime-and-application-compatibility.aspx

yes!! awesome!!!!!