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Discussions

Richard Anthony Hein Richard.Hein Stay on Target
  • "None of us at Microsoft can say anything until //build/ in September."

    "Our approach means no compromises—you get to use whatever kind of device you prefer to run the apps you love. This is sure to inspire a new generation of modern hardware and software development, improving the experience for PC users around the world." - BUILD

    They are also touting this as the biggest thing since Windows 95.  That's a hard sell.  There has to be a reason, and it's not HTML5/JS.

    @ContextFree: Microsoft already has implemented an IL to JS compiler in Volta.  I tried to find a link, but guess what, all the Volta videos are no longer available.  Strange??  Not really.   However, I'll concede that maybe it's C# to JS ... which Script# already does, but not as deeply.  Also see http://hildr.luminance.org/Platformer/Platformer.html ; there's nothing stopping compilation from one Turing complete runtime to another but imagination, and blood, sweat and tears (and buckets of cash). 

  • "None of us at Microsoft can say anything until //build/ in September."

    I think that BUILD will actually be about the new compiler technology that Bartok and Pheonix research has led to, and not just about Windows 8.  I believe that Microsoft doesn't really have much intention to make tools to directly manipulate HTML/JS, but will extend existing tools, in particular Blend and VS to compile down to HTML/JS - and run on a JS based .NET Framework. 

    To facilitate that effort, I think that they will be announcing IL to Javascript compilation, XAML (Silverlight and/or WPF) to HTML/CSS/JS compilation, and a new way of looking at .NET as a whole.  The CLR will still produce IL, but that will be fed into Bartok/Pheonix and allow compilation to JS (as a new, or more properly, a secondary IL), with a JS version of the .NET Framework.  Microsoft is probably sick of trying to get the CLR on every device and will thus have the rest of the market build CLRs for them - via JS interpretors.  This strategy will truly make JS the IL of the web and anything that runs Javascript, will become a CLR. 

    I also think we'll be able to target either CLR=>IL=>JS or CLR=>Bartok/Pheonix=>Native.  I think that there will also be a way to compile parts of an application from CLR=>IL=>JS and parts to native.  As the Windows 8 leaks have demonstrated, the Windows 8 sample applications have HTML/JS UIs, that interop with the Windows Runtime dlls by marshalling JSON through MSHelpUI.dll to other dlls, which appear to be compiled from C# into native dlls.  It also appears that the UI can either be targeted to be output as HTML/JS or XAML/IL, or native Win32.  

    In summary, I think a lot of the ideas of Pheonix, Volta, Bartok etc..., have made it into the Windows 8 stack and rather than moving backwards and abandoning .NET, which is kind of what the HTML/JS push seems like, this is actually a move to make the dream of a true CLR come true.  Microsoft has thus realized that there are only two real CLRs in the world today - native and Javascript, and are going to make sure that the .NET strategy shifts towards having a compiler framework that allows production of code for those CLRs, instead of trying to make the world adopt their CLR.  All the effort that goes into producing various versions of the CLR (and DLR) is better spent making backends for the Pheonix pipeline to target the native or JS based runtimes which other people are building already.

    Of course, I have absolutely no idea if any of this is correct.

  • On the plus side

    @felix9: +1 ... Cool

  • Azure Map Reduce

    @Nabarun:  Hadoop will work on Azure:  http://blogs.msdn.com/b/mariok/archive/2011/05/11/hadoop-in-azure.aspx

     

     

  • Volta - Dead or Alive?

    @fanbaby:  Only in a limited sense where there is compilation/interpretation to JS, but the overarching theme was "democratizing the cloud", by abstracting away notions like tiers and location away.  Rx is a piece of the puzzle by providing an abstraction over push-based streams, and thus allowing LINQ to be used to compose asynchronous operations.  Volta seems to have exposed the need for things like Rx, but I'm just guessing at how it evolved.

  • Volta - Dead or Alive?

    @exoteric:  Volta became the Cloud Programmability Team and released Rx as it's first product.  Although it has changed quite a bit, the goals are similar.

  • User avatars missing?

    So far, every avatar image which I cannot see is hosted at http://video.ch9.ms/ecn/avatars/.  I haven't come across any from other URIs that have the issue (i.e., mine is from http://files.channel9.msdn.com/avatar/).  spivonious' is http://video.ch9.ms/ecn/avatars however, so not all from that URI are failing.

    EDIT:  Now I tried going directly to http://video.ch9.ms/ecn/avatars/Geoffreyk_c9.jpg and it loads.  I reloaded this page, and now spivonious' fails to show as well as geoffreyk, but another refresh and now they are all working.  So it's intermittent.  However, some others (like http://video.ch9.ms/ecn/avatars/Ray7_c9.jpg or http://video.ch9.ms/ecn/avatars/magicalclick_c9.jpg) are showing a 500 internal server error.

  • User avatars missing?

    I've started seeing this problem a few days ago.  I can see my own but I can't see many others, and it seems like it's more everyday.  Weird.  I can see your avatar spivonious, and CKurt's but not Geoffreyk's.

  • I just got this message from my aunt about my other aunt ...

    I don't know how it's going because she hasn't gotten back to me about it.  Oh well.  I'm ok with that. Wink

  • (Constructiv​ely) Criticise my WP7 App.

    @Dr Herbie:  Coundown is missing a t (second screenshot).