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wastingtimewithforums wastingtime​withforums
  • They might have well said...

    By the way:

    http://bgr.com/2013/01/10/iphone-surface-teen-survey-287400/

    Jan 10, 2013
    'Apple is done' and Surface tablet is cool, according to teens

    http://news.thewindowsclub.com/surface-rt-cool-apple-teenagers-59079/

    January 14, 2013

    Buzz Marketing Group has reported that Apple devices have become less popular among the kids. It was the time when kids showed off their Apple products that made them more cool. Things have changed now, the report says Microsoft...  Surface has taken over the Apple. Kids and teenagers find Microsoft Surface RT tablet more cool than Apple product. The Surface RT tablet innovates the tablet market with minimal design and great software within it that drew teenagers attention

    -----

    Yeah, how did that turn out? I have a feeling my bet is pretty safe. It's like betting against the Year of the Linux Desktop.

  • They might have well said...

    , bondsbw wrote

    @wastingtimewithforums:  Yes it is, and that is precisely my point.  What they are planning to buy.  I never said they had bought them yet.

    Who knows, maybe they'll all have a change in heart and prove WTWF right all along!

    I am very sure that the market share will stay the same the next couple of years in the tablet market. The negativitiy surrounding W8 is still huge and the "modern" aesthetic doesn't seem to have a wide appeal, as shown by WP. Android is also turning out to be the Windows of mobile and was always marketed to get as much ground as possible, while Microsoft aimed a doomed-to-fail "we are as cool, closed and as pricey as Apple!"-approach (Surface, locked down app stores, my-way-or-the-highway atmosphere throughout the W8-run).

    So yeah, I bet that not much will change in the coming years.

    You can save this URL and rub it in my face later if you want.

  • They might have well said...

    , bondsbw wrote

    *snip*

    My link is recent.  Yours are months old.  The Surface Pro 3 probably shook some things up.

     

    Bullshit. The newest link is from end of July. That's just two and half months ago. Even if you would get a free gold nugget with every Surface, it couldn't upside the market like that in just two months!

    Have you actually read your own link? It's not a marketshare analysis, but a US-only teen survey of what they might buy! And even then Android is leading ahead of Windows if you count in the Kindle Fire.

  • They might have well said...

    , bondsbw wrote

    That's not an iPad killer, and I'm not claiming it to be even close at this point, but it is better numbers than Android.

    Have you portaled from another dimension?

    http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/tech/tech-news/Android-tablet-market-share-hits-70-in-Q2-iPads-slip-to-25-Survey/articleshow/38966512.cms

    http://www.digitaltrends.com/mobile/android-overtakes-ipad-tablet-market-share-gartner/

  • They might have well said...

    , bondsbw wrote

    So why didn't they commit to bringing the start menu back?  I don't know.  Maybe they didn't want to commit to supporting a feature if the market, in general, decided it didn't want it anymore.

    Oh yeah, that makes sense. No one cared except that the huge shitstorm regarding W8 (of which the metro menu/start menu controversy was a huge part) caused MS to backtrack several times now (Update 1, 8.1, W10).

    And aside from the start menu, what was all the talk about the "legacy desktop" and "legacy apps"? What stopped them clarifying all this if it was all "planned"?

    We have two options:

    1. There was no grand plan and MS was a on a madhatter trip throughout the metro-mania.

    2. There was indeed a completely retarded plan that not even a 80s cartoon villian on crack could cook up so stupid.

    I am not sure why you even bother, because both options cast a bad light on Microsoft anno 2012.

  • They might have well said...

    Your argument was about the start menu and the desktop focus as a whole (of which the start menu is a major part) Don't backtrack.

    http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/They-might-have-well-said/da142dc752754b27bb40a3b8015b6953

    >>DBVS: I could almost agree with you here but you're ignoring the fact that Microsoft unnessarily took away the start menu and added all of the tablet/touch oriented stuff to the desktop. Now they're rolling it all back. You're saying that was thier plan all along?

    >Bondsbw (reply): It seemed to me, right at the beginning of Windows 8 when they made all the announcements at BUILD 2011 (where I got to talk with a few of the developers and managers), Windows 8 was 100% focused on consumer devices, from tablets to touch screen PCs [...]

    Consumer-focused releases are nothing new at Microsoft.  They did it before with 95/98/Me.  But the difference in 2011 was, I think there was no immediate plan for a business-focused release in parallel (like they did with the NT line).

    So I think they just were planning to hold until after the consumer version went out and had a chance to build itself, to turn back focus on their bread-and-butter enterprise customers.

    --------------------------------

    DBVS talked about the removal of the start menu (and the return in W10), and you replied in the vein that it was "planned all along". So yes, the argument was focussed around start menu throughout the whole thread and you only started to backtrack from that point ten minutes ago.

  • They might have well said...

    , kettch wrote

    *snip*

    I don't see anywhere that people say this was "planned all along".

    http://channel9.msdn.com/Forums/Coffeehouse/They-might-have-well-said/da142dc752754b27bb40a3b8015b6953

    It seemed to me, right at the beginning of Windows 8 when they made all the announcements at BUILD 2011 (where I got to talk with a few of the developers and managers), Windows 8 was 100% focused on consumer devices, from tablets to touch screen PCs [...]

    Consumer-focused releases are nothing new at Microsoft.  They did it before with 95/98/Me.  But the difference in 2011 was, I think there was no immediate plan for a business-focused release in parallel (like they did with the NT line).

    So I think they just were planning to hold until after the consumer version went out and had a chance to build itself, to turn back focus on their bread-and-butter enterprise customers.

  • They might have well said...

    OK, I am getting sick of this (doesn't happen so easy, as other "contenders" here can attest).

    We all know removing the start menu was a political decision which backfired later. You're trying throughout the whole thread to construct the notion that "this was all planned along", which is really ridiculous.

    If this was really planned, why all the unneeded angst? Why couldn't MS say in late 2012 that the start menu and other desktop niceties will be coming back soon and calm down everyone? Yet throughout 2012 and in the first half of 2013 MS kept sending messages out that the desktop is "legacy" and it's time to get with the times. Only after the backlash didn't stop they started to change tune.

    If this was really all planned, then it must be one of the lousiest plans in corporate history. Not only have they then unneccessarily scared off and alienated lots of their established customers - they hardly gained any new ones in the segment W8 was for.

  • They might have well said...

    , bondsbw wrote

    *snip*

    They did.  It's called Windows 7.  It came with tablet PC features built-in and available when using tablet hardware.  And it was released a half year before the iPad, so it even had a jump on Apple.

    It obviously did so well.

    The point is that "Windows 10" (start menu and metro GUI, switchable at will) would have been perfectly possible with Windows 8 already and that's exactly what MS should have done - that's what all the fuss and outcry was all about in the first place! Make that stuff optional for desktop users! For God's sake - the first Win8 betas allowed just that with a registry switch; they yanked out the start menu at pretty late development stage. It probably cost them more time rooting the start menu out than just keeping it in.

    And Windows 7 had no tablety-UI, just the bare touch support, so it's obviously not what DBVS meant. And you know it.

  • They might have well said...

    , bondsbw wrote

    *snip*

    Those who think that everything is about today's dollar do not understand the business economics of large corporations very well.  If you need to, sacrifice today in order to survive tomorrow.  I believe that was their strategy. The opposite strategy, making the best damn Windows 7 possible while ignoring mobile, would permanently result in Microsoft's obsolescence as soon as Apple and Google figured out how to market to business customers who want mobile devices.

    Who said something about ignoring?

    It's one thing to target a (semi-)new market, it's another thing going batshit crazy. McDonalds serving salads and donuts is one thing, but McDonalds replacing the BigMac with a burger/donut hybrid that almost everyone hates, raising prices twofold for the Cheeseburger, putting salt into Coke, setting their iconic m-log on fire, recoloring all their outlets to pink, blue and brown, removing the cheese from all dishes and replacing the beef of all burgers with soja all the while proclaiming that NOTHING REALLY CHANGED, STOP COMPLAINING is a completey other thing.

    Microsoft's amok run of the last two years is not much crazier than the McDonald's scenario.  Apart from the whole Windows 8 fiasco, the Xbone produced one of biggest shitstorms of the internet (entirely predictable), there are heavy price hikes in the business segment, Office pricing is upped as well, almost everyone hates the new bleached out/CAPS LOCK themes of Office and Visual Studio, Metro on the server, SBS is killed for lousy reasons, the arrogant handling and shove-it mentality regarding Silverlight, XNA and WPF and the list goes on.

    It's as if their mission statement from 2012 on was to anger just about every single user base of theirs. And all this created of course massive negativity that spreads to their newer endeavors as well: Windows 8 tablets are still doing quite lousy compared to Android and iOS - no wonder.

    If IE4 would have been bundled in W98 with the same mindset as today, W98 would boot directly into internet explorer with no way to obvious to quit and to launch any programs you would need to open up Microsoft.com/programname in IE every time while watching MS ads that always end with with the tagline don't be afraid of change!