Comment Feed for Channel 9 - Inside SPUR - A Trace-Based JIT Compiler for CIL http://ecn.channel9.msdn.com/o9/previewImages/100/542071_100x75.jpg Channel 9 - Inside SPUR - A Trace-Based JIT Compiler for CIL Computer Scientists and MSR Researchers Wolfram Schulte, Herman Venter, Nikolai Tillmann, and Manuel Fahndrich join Erik Meijer for an Expert to Expert deep dive into the theory and implementation strategies inside of SPUR, a research Tracing Just-In-Time (TJIT) compiler for Microsoft’s Common Intermediate Language CIL (the target language of C#, VB.NET, F#, and many other .NET languages).  Tracing just-in-time compilers (TJITs) determine frequently executed traces (hot paths and loops) in running programs and focus their optimization effort by emitting optimized machine code specialized to these traces. Prior work has established this strategy to be especially beneficial for dynamic languages such as JavaScript, where the TJIT interfaces with the interpreter and produces machine code from the JavaScript trace. In order to validate that the performance gains of a TJIT for interpreted languages like JavaScript do not depend on specific idioms of the language, the SPUR team produces a performance evaluation of a JavaScript runtime that translates JavaScript to CIL and then runs on top of SPUR.Read the SPUR research paper. en Thu, 23 May 2013 07:07:14 GMT Thu, 23 May 2013 07:07:14 GMT Rev9 Re: Inside SPUR - A Trace-Based JIT Compiler for CIL Thanks.  Interesting stuff.  Is java script going to be it forever on the browser?  Erik does work using java script as an IL.  In my simple mind, that seems like a good workaround, but not a complete solution.  Will something like this allow any language to run on browser?  Like a compiler as a service in the browser deal?

 

In terms of singularity.  Is there an exit summary?  What are the learnings?  Was there a dead-end?  Was there a discovery that lead to new direction and/or project?  tia   

posted by staceyw

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634069549850000000 Thu, 15 Apr 2010 19:03:05 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634069549850000000 staceyw Re: Inside SPUR - A Trace-Based JIT Compiler for CIL In terms of  Singularity, that was simply a side conversation, unrelated in context... Singularity is and has always been a research project, a test bed for OS proof-of-concept development. The Singularity researchers are the ones who should speak about Singularity's current and future states... I have no idea if/when this will happen.

 

Again, Singularity is a "platform" for scientific experimentation related to operating system research.

 

C

posted by Charles

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634069555540000000 Thu, 15 Apr 2010 19:12:34 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634069555540000000 Charles Re: Inside SPUR - A Trace-Based JIT Compiler for CIL Compiling MSIL to JavaScript is the opposite of SPUR, which compiles JavaScript to MSIL. The interesting hypothesis of using a tracing JIT is that it does not matter at which side of the equation you start since all hot abstractions will be "traced away" at runtime. The potential of no-pay abstraction is quite enticing. It is like being able to feast on an all-you-can-eat buffet without gaining any weight Smiley

posted by head.in.the.box

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634069592870000000 Thu, 15 Apr 2010 20:14:47 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634069592870000000 head.in.the.box Re: Inside SPUR - A Trace-Based JIT Compiler for CIL Awesome analogy, Erik! Smiley

 

Hmm. A buffet with a JIT that traces away calories. Yes, a BJIT.  Las Vegas should be the first place to implement this... Wink
C

posted by Charles

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634069602720000000 Thu, 15 Apr 2010 20:31:12 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634069602720000000 Charles Re: Inside SPUR - A Trace-Based JIT Compiler for CIL How does this relate to statically typed languages like C#? Does it improve upon the normal JIT for those too? Apologies if this is answered in the video. I'm bandwidth-limited at the moment so I'll have to watch it later.

posted by sylvan

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634069610690000000 Thu, 15 Apr 2010 20:44:29 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634069610690000000 sylvan Re: Inside SPUR - A Trace-Based JIT Compiler for CIL Interesting video about a interesting topic. I'm wondering how much a ASP.NET server application could benefit from such a technology. Because such a process runs for a long, long time and therefore even more costly optimizations might pay off. Especially because costly optimizations could run as background task without problems.

 

Anyway, very I hope will see more interesting research work in this area =)

posted by GamlerHart

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634069622980000000 Thu, 15 Apr 2010 21:04:58 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634069622980000000 GamlerHart Re: Inside SPUR - A Trace-Based JIT Compiler for CIL Interesting video. Smiley

 

Btw, Charles, Erik, do you know the best way I could get an answer to my question for the JSMeter team?

posted by ShinNoNoir

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634069627510000000 Thu, 15 Apr 2010 21:12:31 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634069627510000000 ShinNoNoir Re: Inside SPUR - A Trace-Based JIT Compiler for CIL I FW'd your question to Ben and Ben.
C

posted by Charles

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634069631790000000 Thu, 15 Apr 2010 21:19:39 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634069631790000000 Charles Re: Inside SPUR - A Trace-Based JIT Compiler for CIL background theorem prover that tracing itself, what an idea ! sounds like a M.C. Escher artwork. Smiley

and, automatic parallelization in the runtime, wow, truly a gold mine ......

nicely done Charles, and thank you for asking the singularity question.

hope tracing can get into .NET 'beep', today's research is tomorrows reality.

since .NET 4 wave is already released c9 should do more 'future' videos like this. Tongue Out

posted by felix9

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634069658970000000 Thu, 15 Apr 2010 22:04:57 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634069658970000000 felix9 Re: Inside SPUR - A Trace-Based JIT Compiler for CIL Yes, SPUR is a tracing JIT for MSIL.

posted by head.in.the.box

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634069884110000000 Fri, 16 Apr 2010 04:20:11 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634069884110000000 head.in.the.box Re: Inside SPUR - A Trace-Based JIT Compiler for CIL 16:30 is what I love about Channel9.  Where else can you find this kind of content?

 

Treat the type as a probabilty wave, and delay the wave collapse until observation.  Exceptions can occur on observation, so you Amb them, (Amb in groups of greatest probability, and recursively) for the first one that doesn't, if all do, you have a fatal exception.  You pick the probabilities that result in the least possible exceptions, to optimize.   But an Exception is really a type conversion.  It may not be what you expect but it's a type.  Maybe it is supposed to have a string with numbers appended.  Swap code/thread that was running in parallel.

 

I have to watch this all again now.  Now I just found this paper saying that there is no least fixed point sematics for Amb, I have a lot to learn. 

posted by Richard.Hein

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634069947710000000 Fri, 16 Apr 2010 06:06:11 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634069947710000000 Richard.Hein Re: Inside SPUR - A Trace-Based JIT Compiler for CIL Superb video! Smiley

 

It does indeed look like a research gold-mine.

 

Theorem-proving at run-time, tracing, abstract interpretation. Quite a sophisticated set of ideas.

posted by exoteric

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634069994760000000 Fri, 16 Apr 2010 07:24:36 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634069994760000000 exoteric Re: Inside SPUR - A Trace-Based JIT Compiler for CIL On Singularity, it's interesting that it was a very static approach whereas the tracing approach is much more dynamic in nature but as far as can extract from articles on the Web, there exists an incubation team continuing on the basis that Singularity established.

 

Also, the idea that Erik mentions of an entire browser being written in C# or some other safe language compiled to MSIL and then traced is pretty cool. The browser and scripts both being traced together.

 

Also interesting is the Z3 theorem prover. I forget what it's written in, probably C++. It would be interesting if that was ported to perhaps first C++/IL and later to F# (which is probably a better language for a theorem prover).

posted by exoteric

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634070016210000000 Fri, 16 Apr 2010 08:00:21 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634070016210000000 exoteric Re: Inside SPUR - A Trace-Based JIT Compiler for CIL  "Front-ends interact with Z3 by using either a textual format or a binary 

API. Three textual input-formats are supported: The SMT-LIB [12] format, the

Simplify [8] format, and a low-level native format in the spirit of the DIMACS

format for propositional SAT formulas. One can also call Z3 procedurally by

using either an ANSI C API, an API for the .NET managed common language

runtime, or an OCaml API.", and "Z3 is implemented in C++".

http://research.microsoft.com/en-us/um/redmond/projects/z3/z3.pdf

 

Smiley

 

 

posted by Richard.Hein

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634072086120000000 Sun, 18 Apr 2010 17:30:12 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634072086120000000 Richard.Hein Re: Inside SPUR - A Trace-Based JIT Compiler for CIL Cool, once again a managed implementation of JScript faster than the "current" version of IE's native one. When Managed JScript was still on going, it was faster than IE8's interpreter-based JScript.

So SPUR doesn't yet support neseted trace trees. I wonder if they will consider the trace scheme used in LuaJIT 2 where it doesn't use trace trees, but still supports nested loops well. FYI http://lua-users.org/lists/lua-l/2009-11/msg00089.html

The possibility of being able to trace all the way into SPUR itself is also very interesting. That would evolve into another metacircular VM. Hopefully it'll come true some day.

posted by Ravenex

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634083157940000000 Sat, 01 May 2010 13:03:14 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634083157940000000 Ravenex Re: Inside SPUR - A Trace-Based JIT Compiler for CIL Page 2 will not load for me.  This has happened before.

posted by Richard.Hein

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634091387390000000 Tue, 11 May 2010 01:38:59 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634091387390000000 Richard.Hein Re: Inside SPUR - A Trace-Based JIT Compiler for CIL I can't repro.

C

posted by Charles

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634092175380000000 Tue, 11 May 2010 23:32:18 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/E2E-Tracing-JIT-and-SPUR#c634092175380000000 Charles