Comment Feed for Channel 9 - Inside Windows 8: Arun Kishan - Windows App Model http://media.ch9.ms/ch9/c352/0277afdb-2b6b-4347-bd4a-8b90e96ac352/InsideWin8ArunKishanAppModel_220.jpg Channel 9 - Inside Windows 8: Arun Kishan - Windows App Model Arun Kishan digs into the low level details of Windows 8's new application model. How has Process Lifetime Management (PLM) been reimagined in Windows 8? How does app suspension work, exactly, or, what happens when an app is no longer in the foreground and not closed? How much work can you do in the background when an app is suspended? Arun covers several topics here, so please do set aside some quality time. In return, you will gain new levels of deep understanding that will help you take advantage of the Windows Store App platform and build excellent modern Windows applications.You've met Arun before, so you should be prepared for some very deep treatment of this new world for Windows and Windows developers. This is an excellent 400 level investigation of the core changes that support the new app model. Huge thanks to Arun for another exceptional conversation and whiteboard session. Tune in. Learn. en Sat, 25 May 2013 03:28:42 GMT Sat, 25 May 2013 03:28:42 GMT Rev9 Re: Inside Windows 8: Arun Kishan - Windows App Model Perfect timing, this is high up on my 'must grok' list. Thank you Charles and Arun.

posted by tomkirbygreen

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634891270706746409 Wed, 21 Nov 2012 20:37:50 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634891270706746409 tomkirbygreen Re: Inside Windows 8: Arun Kishan - Windows App Model Great info and effectively presented. A question, how can one monitor all this quota consumption during development/testing in order to have an idea of what the app is consuming and perhaps re-desing the app if needed? 

posted by aljj

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634892123672525838 Thu, 22 Nov 2012 20:19:27 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634892123672525838 aljj Re: Inside Windows 8: Arun Kishan - Windows App Model @aljj: A simple way, in terms of, say, memory consumption and cpu usage, is to just use Task Manager in another window (so, if you have two monitors, you can run your app on one and TM on the other). This is quick and easy, but limited in usefulness... Then there's the SysInternals tools (procmon, procexp, for example). For a rather complex WinRT app I've been involved with (mainly testing and debugging), PerfView and WinDbg have proven quite useful as well as ProcDump. XPerf is also your friend.

Hope this helps,
C

posted by Charles

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634892128351778191 Thu, 22 Nov 2012 20:27:15 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634892128351778191 Charles Re: Inside Windows 8: Arun Kishan - Windows App Model Super Valuable Informatioon!

Is there any documentation about it?

posted by VironPapadopoulos

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634892272944004479 Fri, 23 Nov 2012 00:28:14 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634892272944004479 VironPapadopoulos Re: Inside Windows 8: Arun Kishan - Windows App Model posted by Rahul

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634892643607903792 Fri, 23 Nov 2012 10:46:00 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634892643607903792 Rahul Re: Inside Windows 8: Arun Kishan - Windows App Model Thank you for sharing! Smiley totally awesome.

 How much of this apply to the phone?

posted by fabian

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634892893282964296 Fri, 23 Nov 2012 17:42:08 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634892893282964296 fabian Re: Inside Windows 8: Arun Kishan - Windows App Model @VironPapadopoulos: Not sure about documentation that covers this level of detail. This conversation looks at the new app model from the inside out. For pragmatic developer guidance focused on the API level, http://dev.windows.com is the right place.
C

posted by Charles

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634892951007602341 Fri, 23 Nov 2012 19:18:20 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634892951007602341 Charles Re: Inside Windows 8: Arun Kishan - Windows App Model

@ch9 What about "Inside Windows 8 kernel changes" with Arun Kishan like @markrussinovich did back in 2009 about W7? Who will replace Mark?

— Sergei Matiushkin (@sergmat) November 23, 2012

posted by sermat

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634892999077295126 Fri, 23 Nov 2012 20:38:27 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634892999077295126 sermat Re: Inside Windows 8: Arun Kishan - Windows App Model @Charles Has anyone around MS been discussing the appx application model for server applications? With the exceptions of the UI specific stuff all of this work would make for more efficient/secure server applications as well.

posted by B3NT

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634893021067732347 Fri, 23 Nov 2012 21:15:06 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634893021067732347 B3NT Re: Inside Windows 8: Arun Kishan - Windows App Model @sermat: Glad you asked. There is no replacement for Mark, of course, but I have gone around and filmed conversations with the Windows kernel team (like Arun, for example) and topics include (and will include for upcoming interviews):

Windows 8 Thread Pool (Filmed)
Windows 8 Scheduler (To be filmed)
Windows 8 Heap Manager (Filmed)
Windows 8 Power Management (Filmed)
Windows 8 Desktop Activity Moderator (http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/hh848040(v=vs.85).aspx) (Filmed)
Windows 8 Telemetry and Performance (Filmed)
Windows 8 Boot (Filmed)

These will be released on a cadence that isn't going to be as fast as you like, but it's the best we can do...

C

posted by Charles

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634893030558943035 Fri, 23 Nov 2012 21:30:55 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634893030558943035 Charles Re: Inside Windows 8: Arun Kishan - Windows App Model @B3NT: Not sure I understand. The Windows 8 modern client app model is designed to support single-instance application execution and lifetime management (Windows Store apps). You wouldn't want this on a server, nor would you want a limited background process execution model (for the client, limited means battery-optimized... The degree of background processing I asked Arun about isn't really something any app can leverage today (again, for good reason - battery life...), but the core capability is present in Windows 8,).

Can you elaborate?

C

posted by Charles

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634893033695735641 Fri, 23 Nov 2012 21:36:09 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634893033695735641 Charles Re: Inside Windows 8: Arun Kishan - Windows App Model @fabian: WP8 and Windows 8 do share kernel-level code, but not all of the Windows 8 kernel is present in the WP8 OS for hopefully obvious reasons. Beyond that, take a look at this talk from BUILD 2012 about the Windows Phone 8 App Model -> http://channel9.msdn.com/Events/Build/2012/2-013

C

posted by Charles

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634893040350423117 Fri, 23 Nov 2012 21:47:15 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634893040350423117 Charles Re: Inside Windows 8: Arun Kishan - Windows App Model @Charles: Awesome, looking forward to watching all those ... but what about "Going Deep: Inside WinRT XAML"? Smiley Or here's an idea, you could do an Expert to Expert with Erik Meijer and someone from the XAML team, and talk about the relation between Reactive Programming and data binding engines such as XAML's ... or you could even try to get Paul Betts on to talk about ReactiveUI ... Smiley

posted by contextfree`

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634893164129348753 Sat, 24 Nov 2012 01:13:32 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634893164129348753 contextfree` Re: Inside Windows 8: Arun Kishan - Windows App Model @Charles: What about AppContainer ?? Smiley

And finally you can say the word 'Jupiter' in public now ? Tongue Out

posted by felix9

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634893351602954764 Sat, 24 Nov 2012 06:26:00 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634893351602954764 felix9 Re: Inside Windows 8: Arun Kishan - Windows App Model

, Charles wrote

There is no replacement for Mark, of course

 

, Charles wrote

I have gone around and filmed conversations with the Windows kernel team... it's the best we can do...

posted by sermat

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634893411675796497 Sat, 24 Nov 2012 08:06:07 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634893411675796497 sermat Re: Inside Windows 8: Arun Kishan - Windows App Model

, Charles wrote

There is no replacement for Mark, of course

I hope he was not drove away from WinDiv by Sinofsky. Devil Devil

posted by felix9

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634893554005955447 Sat, 24 Nov 2012 12:03:20 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634893554005955447 felix9 Re: Inside Windows 8: Arun Kishan - Windows App Model

, felix9 wrote

*snip*

I hope he was not drove away from WinDiv by Sinofsky. Devil Devil

He has moved to Server & Tools to work on the Azure Kernel (or App Fabric controller) and has been there for a couple of years. He is still performing updates to Sysinternals and releasing books, so he is still there.

Arun is an Architect on the Kernel team and a Technical Fellow in waiting.

 

posted by vesuvius

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634893719993598337 Sat, 24 Nov 2012 16:39:59 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634893719993598337 vesuvius Re: Inside Windows 8: Arun Kishan - Windows App Model OK, what I meant to say was, I hope 'the reason for Mark to left WinDiv and went to Azure' is not about (the aggresiveness, etc of) Sinofsky.

Ah, bad joke.

posted by felix9

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634893768197887317 Sat, 24 Nov 2012 18:00:19 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634893768197887317 felix9 Re: Inside Windows 8: Arun Kishan - Windows App Model @felix9: AppContainer is a bit of a misnomer. The kernel name for AppContainer is "lowbox", and all of the security provisions of AppContainer are available to normal apps as well.

In fact, IE10 on the desktop runs as two processes (as it has since IE8); the low "rendering" process which always used to run as "Low-integrity" on Windows Vista and above now runs as "AppContainer" on Windows8, even though the renderer is not an app.

Although not formally exposed and technically subject to change without notice, you can create your own AppContainer processes via ntdll!NtCreateLowBoxToken API, which you can use to create appcontainer protected desktop apps by using it as the user token to advapi32!CreateProcessAsUser.

HTH.

posted by evildictaitor

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634895167689319209 Mon, 26 Nov 2012 08:52:48 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634895167689319209 evildictaitor Re: Inside Windows 8: Arun Kishan - Windows App Model

, felix9 wrote

I hope [Mark Russinovich] was not drove away from WinDiv by Sinofsky. Devil Devil

He's senior tech lead for Azure, so he's not really been involved all that much in Win8. http://blogs.technet.com/b/markrussinovich/

posted by evildictaitor

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634895169430695487 Mon, 26 Nov 2012 08:55:43 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634895169430695487 evildictaitor Re: Inside Windows 8: Arun Kishan - Windows App Model posted by waqar

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634963673956491388 Wed, 13 Feb 2013 15:49:55 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634963673956491388 waqar Re: Inside Windows 8: Arun Kishan - Windows App Model

posted by Vish

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634964147050568958 Thu, 14 Feb 2013 04:58:25 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634964147050568958 Vish Re: Inside Windows 8: Arun Kishan - Windows App Model posted by Indra

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634986112591541242 Mon, 11 Mar 2013 15:07:39 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/Going+Deep/Inside-Windows-8-Arun-Kishan-Windows-App-Model#c634986112591541242 Indra