Comment Feed for Channel 9 - Marina Polishchuk: VC++ QA - The best job in the biz http://ecn.channel9.msdn.com/o9/previewImages/100/249281_100x75.jpg Channel 9 - Marina Polishchuk: VC++ QA - The best job in the biz Meet Marina Polishchuk, a software engineer on the VC++ quality control team. Her mission: Outsmart the compiler with clever programs that confuse and or break it. Fun stuff. Here, we learn about what she does, why she does it and how she got here. Enjoy! en Wed, 19 Jun 2013 00:54:33 GMT Wed, 19 Jun 2013 00:54:33 GMT Rev9 Re: Marina Polishchuk: VC++ QA - The best job in the biz

posted by ChrisP

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633077800370000000 Thu, 22 Feb 2007 22:27:17 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633077800370000000 ChrisP Re: Marina Polishchuk: VC++ QA - The best job in the biz
So, to QA a particular feature in the compiler, you must know that feature really well, right? Or knowing it well is actually a hinderance -- because you sorta gotta buy into that usage pattern.

posted by Minh

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633078115590000000 Fri, 23 Feb 2007 07:12:39 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633078115590000000 Minh Re: Marina Polishchuk: VC++ QA - The best job in the biz

posted by Skriker V1.0

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633078176760000000 Fri, 23 Feb 2007 08:54:36 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633078176760000000 Skriker V1.0 Re: Marina Polishchuk: VC++ QA - The best job in the biz
I think his record was breaking something without even touching it (it was an IR remote thing, and he just put his hand between transmitter and receiver for a second - the whole thing went titsup.)

posted by Massif

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633078184020000000 Fri, 23 Feb 2007 09:06:42 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633078184020000000 Massif Re: Marina Polishchuk: VC++ QA - The best job in the biz

posted by eyeris

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633078418900000000 Fri, 23 Feb 2007 15:38:10 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633078418900000000 eyeris Re: Marina Polishchuk: VC++ QA - The best job in the biz

posted by j0217995

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633078479030000000 Fri, 23 Feb 2007 17:18:23 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633078479030000000 j0217995 Re: Marina Polishchuk: VC++ QA - The best job in the biz
eyeris wrote:
Please give this girl her own tag. Maybe... "Marina"?


In C9v4, there are tags for those who appear in videos so you can see everything someone has been in.

posted by HumanCompiler

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633078647920000000 Fri, 23 Feb 2007 21:59:52 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633078647920000000 HumanCompiler Re: Marina Polishchuk: VC++ QA - The best job in the biz
Minh wrote:
So, to QA a particular feature in the compiler, you must know that feature really well, right?

White box testing.
Minh wrote:
Or knowing it well is actually a hinderance -- because you sorta gotta buy into that usage pattern.

Black box testing.

posted by JChung2006

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633078787550000000 Sat, 24 Feb 2007 01:52:35 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633078787550000000 JChung2006 Re: Marina Polishchuk: VC++ QA - The best job in the biz
Minh wrote:
I'd never thought about what it would take to QA a compiler before. QA in my previous companies haven't been at all technical. What they were good at is trying weird stuff on the UI to try to break stuff.

So, to QA a particular feature in the compiler, you must know that feature really well, right? Or knowing it well is actually a hinderance -- because you sorta gotta buy into that usage pattern.



In the case of C++, solid testing of scenarios enabled by a new feature definitely requires knowing it well, in my opinion (even tests for simple scenarios can always break as the compiler evolves, which is one motivation to have tests at all levels of complexity in place).  If you're referring to the implementation itself, I think knowing the specifics of implementation details can sometimes  be helpful in coming up with a nice breaking test case, but may not be the most productive way to write thorough tests on the whole.

In my experience, the ability to break the compiler usually comes from using a feature in conjunction with other elements of C++ (including itself)  in an atypical way (e.g.: testing A<5> vs. A<B<7>::value> where B<T> inherits from A<T>...). 

posted by Marina-

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633078842660000000 Sat, 24 Feb 2007 03:24:26 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633078842660000000 Marina- Re: Marina Polishchuk: VC++ QA - The best job in the biz
Marina- wrote:

In my experience, the ability to break the compiler usually comes from using a feature in conjunction with other elements of C++ (including itself)  in an atypical way (e.g.: testing A<5> vs. A<B<7>::value> where B<T> inherits from A<T>...). 


Sounds interesting. Testing seems to be very systematic, then. So you build a tree of all the possible thing you can do in a particular feature, then, say, run through each scenario.

So, C++ is a fairly static language, even with templates. The compiler does most of the work, but what happen when you're QA'ing a more dynamic language? I guess you just replace the compiler with the run-time... hehe... "just"...

I wonder if a language like Ruby would be an order of magnitude harder to QA than C++...

posted by Minh

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633079444440000000 Sat, 24 Feb 2007 20:07:24 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633079444440000000 Minh Re: Marina Polishchuk: VC++ QA - The best job in the biz Real interesting - sounds intense, gives me a better understanding of all the complexities going on every time I hit Ctrl-Shift-B Smiley

Keep up the good work Wink

posted by DannyJ

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633079502980000000 Sat, 24 Feb 2007 21:44:58 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633079502980000000 DannyJ Re: Marina Polishchuk: VC++ QA - The best job in the biz Marina,

I am astonished at the fact that you really never did anything with computers until your freshman year in college and then end up working on the V C++ team at Microsoft! That is very impressive!

Did you go to the University of Washington or somewhere else?  What were you favorite computer science classes and why?

Thanks,

Flea++

posted by Flea++

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633081196300000000 Mon, 26 Feb 2007 20:47:10 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633081196300000000 Flea++ Re: Marina Polishchuk: VC++ QA - The best job in the biz

posted by DannyJ

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633081200940000000 Mon, 26 Feb 2007 20:54:54 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633081200940000000 DannyJ Re: Marina Polishchuk: VC++ QA - The best job in the biz

Flea++ wrote:

Did you go to the University of Washington or somewhere else?

No, I went to schools in the Midwest (of comparable size).  

Flea++ wrote:

 What were you favorite computer science classes and why?

For me, enjoyment of specific courses was highly dependent on the quality of the professor, and the lack of professor's attachment to giving busy work.  My favorite general topics in CS were: Theory of Computation, Cryptography, Databases, and all of the Compiler/Programming Languages courses.

posted by Marina-

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633084017490000000 Fri, 02 Mar 2007 03:09:09 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633084017490000000 Marina- Re: Marina Polishchuk: VC++ QA - The best job in the biz posted by Flea++

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633086975130000000 Mon, 05 Mar 2007 13:18:33 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633086975130000000 Flea++ Re: Marina Polishchuk: VC++ QA - The best job in the biz Content removed. Please do not post comments like this.
C

posted by wleara

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633163243810000000 Fri, 01 Jun 2007 19:53:01 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633163243810000000 wleara Re: Marina Polishchuk: VC++ QA - The best job in the biz Got here from link off Sutter's blog.  I notice this was posted quite a while ago, but I think I'll comment, anyhow.

Watching the video definately gets me thinking about how fun it would be to work as an SDET on the VS team.  The interviewer is a little screwy, but you seem to fend off his strange questions pretty well, Marina =)  Of course, I'm sure it's difficult to be in either position (interviewer/interviewee), so good job to both of you.

posted by Merlyn

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633230362090000000 Sat, 18 Aug 2007 12:16:49 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633230362090000000 Merlyn Re: Marina Polishchuk: VC++ QA - The best job in the biz As the interviewer mentioned lots of times:D, it's really cool to somehow force the compiler. Really loved your job

posted by deoxriboz

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633399585860000000 Sat, 01 Mar 2008 08:56:26 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633399585860000000 deoxriboz Re: Marina Polishchuk: VC++ QA - The best job in the biz posted by Poonaka

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633419743860000000 Mon, 24 Mar 2008 16:53:06 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633419743860000000 Poonaka Re: Marina Polishchuk: VC++ QA - The best job in the biz The job title, "Software Development Engineer in Test" is in fact as ambigous as overloading a function on the basis of return type, which can confuse most compilers. In formal QA,

SDE sitting in test?
or
SDE operating in test?
or
..

posted by umer_a

]]> http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633470614070000000 Thu, 22 May 2008 13:56:47 GMT http://channel9.msdn.com/Shows/WM_IN/Marina-Polishchuk-VC-QA-The-best-job-in-the-biz#c633470614070000000 umer_a