Windows Home Server - Now a reality | The Coffeehouse

Stephen

Whilst scribbling up a blog entry about CES 2007 whilst watching the Bill Gates Keynote live now, I wanted to link to the CES coverage over at on10.net and a new video has just been posted.

http://on10.net/Blogs/tina/windows-home-server-will-live-in-your-closet-simplify-your-life/

"As a small, headless box that lives on your network and in your closet, a Windows Home Server can quickly grow the pool of storage from which all of your shared files for each of your users lives. The backup engine in Windows Home Server also silently backs up the entirety of each machine connected to it every night. And because the data is always online, using the built-in remote access abilities, you’ll also be able to access your data from any machine on the planet."

BryanF

Yeah, it looks like it could be really cool. I do have two questions though:

(1) Will you be able to back up 360 content to the server? Given that current models only have a 20G disk, and that you can download movies and TV--or, apparently at some point in the future, use the 360 as a DVR--that would be really useful, particularly if it could be streamed to other Media Center PCs / Extenders or even played through Media Player.

(2) Can this be used as a way to transfer files and/or settings to a new PC?

Stephen

http://www.winsupersite.com/reviews/whs_preview.asp

PT has a fair bit of info on it now... 2003 Server R2 Based

"With WHS, storage is hot-swappable. You can plug in an 80 GB hard drive, for example, and configure it quickly with the WHS Add Drive wizard. When you want to remove it and replace it with a 500 GB drive, there's a simple wizard for that as well."

...

"Sharing is another key issue, of course, and perhaps the most predictable task that Microsoft could take on with WHS. As such, WHS will indeed act as the hub for your connected home and connect all the Media Center PCs, Xbox 360s, Windows XP and Vista-based PCs, Windows Mobile devices, Zunes, and other devices you may own."

TimP

Looks pretty cool, although it seems like you'll only be able to get this by buying a "Windows Home Server" device, which is a little disappointing since unlike Windows Media Player, it's not supporting any fancy video capture hardware, just disks and network cards. I'm guessing it will eventually be available through some OEM channels like Newegg, though.

It was interesting that the PM said that remote desktop was the "killer feature" and how he was emphasizing its security. Windows XP Pro has had this since release and it's always been encrypted. In my opinion, the ability to make images of entire computers and restore them was by far the most impressive feature demonstrated.

In the post a couple of days ago about this I complained about the lack of any integrated Windows authentication and it seems that WHS is no improvement. It looks like you get a separate user name and password to access your data.

Bas
It finds lightbulbs.

I'm excited about it, and can't wait to install one here. I especially love the storage pooling. That's just.. amazing. I wonder if it's cheaper to buy a complete system or just get a shuttle and slap some hardware in there.

I wonder how they're handling security, though. Everybody's home PC's accessible via your Live ID from anywhere? That's going to be like heaven for hackers..

Bas
It finds lightbulbs.

TimP wrote:
Looks pretty cool, although it seems like you'll only be able to get this by buying a "Windows Home Server" device

According to what I read on Paul Thorrot's site, you can just get the software for it and slap it on any device you want.

imekon
Bah humbug!

Stephen wrote:

Whilst scribbling up a blog entry about CES 2007 whilst watching the Bill Gates Keynote live now, I wanted to link to the CES coverage over at on10.net and a new video has just been posted.

http://on10.net/Blogs/tina/windows-home-server-will-live-in-your-closet-simplify-your-life/

"As a small, headless box that lives on your network and in your closet, a Windows Home Server can quickly grow the pool of storage from which all of your shared files for each of your users lives. The backup engine in Windows Home Server also silently backs up the entirety of each machine connected to it every night. And because the data is always online, using the built-in remote access abilities, you’ll also be able to access your data from any machine on the planet."

Gee, why am I underwhelmed...

I don't keep my server in a closet but I've had this for the last year or two.

My server has a series of large disks attached, runs an IMAP server so all my mail is stored there. I can access it securely from anywhere in the world (mail and data).

I use Thunderbird for mail, so I can read my mail on the three platforms I use: Windows, Mac and Linux. Will Windows Home Server do the same?

TimP

Saw this on digg, it's HP's Windows Home Server hardware offering:

http://www.hp.com/hpinfo/newsroom/press_kits/2007/ces/ds_de_mediasmartserver.pdf

Looks really slick. Holds four SATA drives, has a gigabit network card, and only 10" tall, 5.5" wide, and 9" deep. If they can offer it for a reasonable price I can see this selling like hot cakes. It's a good fit for home users who want a device that "just works" as well as people who don't want to be IT support for their house and want a more simple solution than setting up a Windows Server 2003 box. Props to Microsoft for letting it work with OS X and Linux, too. (Both have had SMB support for a while, but Microsoft didn't go out of their way to break compatibility.)

TimP

imekon wrote:

Gee, why am I underwhelmed...

I don't keep my server in a closet but I've had this for the last year or two.

My server has a series of large disks attached, runs an IMAP server so all my mail is stored there. I can access it securely from anywhere in the world (mail and data).

I use Thunderbird for mail, so I can read my mail on the three platforms I use: Windows, Mac and Linux. Will Windows Home Server do the same?

It's not really being sold on its technical merits, but its ease of use. I've had a Linux server running for over a year that serves files over SMB, NFS, and FTP as well as running a web server, database, local DNS, etc. but I don't think most people would be willing to set it up from scratch. You can even do most of the same stuff (except maybe NFS) out of the box with Windows Server 2003, but it's expensive and still more work to setup than Windows Home Server.

In my opinion, this serves as a replacement (on steroids) to the simple network attached storage in a box solutions that you can buy at Best Buy (such as the Buffalo TeraStation). I don't think they're looking to convert people who run Linux servers or Windows Server 2003 servers in their home because they're more likely to already be using services that Windows Home Server doesn't provide.

That said, the new form factor that's coming with Windows Home Server (see link above) will probably appeal to everyone. The ability to (soon) have 4TB of storage in box less than one square foot in size is very enticing, regardless of what operating system you use.

Bas
It finds lightbulbs.

imekon wrote:
Gee, why am I underwhelmed...

I don't keep my server in a closet but I've had this for the last year or two.
My server has a series of large disks attached, runs an IMAP server so all my mail is stored there. I can access it securely from anywhere in the world (mail and data).

The point is, will you be able to set the same thing up for your mom? Reasonably cheap? And will she be able to manage it herself?

imekon
Bah humbug!

Bas wrote:

imekon wrote:Gee, why am I underwhelmed...

I don't keep my server in a closet but I've had this for the last year or two.
My server has a series of large disks attached, runs an IMAP server so all my mail is stored there. I can access it securely from anywhere in the world (mail and data).

The point is, will you be able to set the same thing up for your mom? Reasonably cheap? And will she be able to manage it herself?

My mum doesn't go near computers; my dad does. Since he has trouble with a Windows PC, I'd have to automate it for him. Since he's on broadband, he could use my server. Setting it up would only cost my time.

Will Windows Home Server work across the internet?

Dr Herbie
Horses for courses

I am singularly unimpressed.

Do we really need more people leaving PC boxes switched on 24 hours a day, using electricity all the while? Shouldn't we be more interested in technologies that reduce power consumption for home PC users (as well as business PCs)?

Who is the target audience here, anyway? I know hardly anyone with more that one PC at home. If you've only got one PC do you really need a server for it?

Herbie

Massif
aim stupidly high, expect to fail often.

Does it do the only really useful thing I want: Keep user accounts in sync across different computers? (i.e. roaming profiles at home?) I know this is almost unworkable because of different apps being on different computers, but dammit! i want it!

die-Sel

From Engadget.com:

It's not too often you get a new version of Windows, so when Bill Gates announced Windows Home Server tonight we had to learn what's what. Here's the rundown of the facts on Windows Home Server, as told to us by Microsoft:

Units are headless and embedded only -- you cannot buy WHS and put it on an old PC.
There is no common web interface. Interaction is entirely client software based, or done over SMB.
It cannot directly stream media to Media Center Extenders, but it can stream media directly to Windows Media Connect-enabled devices.
It does not use RAID, but instead uses a RAID-like drive pooling system with built-in redundancy. Expanding capacity is as simple as adding additional drives internally or externally via USB. We can't say for sure, but we have a feeling if you were to unplug that external drive, your data wouldn't go with it since it's probably spanned across the array.
The client software, which is installable only on Windows PCs (duh) monitors PC health, manages backups, and supports full disk images and versions. If your computer crashes hard you can pop in an restore CD and it'll pull the disk image over the network.
Your WHS device gets registered with your Windows Live account and is made easily-findable by authorized parties (i.e. you and anyone you designate) while on the go. You can even connect to it via Live and pipe a Remote Desktop connection to a PC on your home network through this Home-finding Live feature.

Bas
It finds lightbulbs.

die-Sel wrote:
From Engadget.com:

It's not too often you get a new version of Windows, so when Bill Gates announced Windows Home Server tonight we had to learn what's what. Here's the rundown of the facts on Windows Home Server, as told to us by Microsoft:

Units are headless and embedded only -- you cannot buy WHS and put it on an old PC.
There is no common web interface. Interaction is entirely client software based, or done over SMB.

Hmm. Confusing, because according to Paul Thurrot:

Bas wrote:

Microsoft will make WHS available in two ways: Bundled with new WHS hardware and software-only, the latter so that enthusiasts can install the system on the hardware of their choice.

Also, I'm seeing screenshots of that non-existant web interface there, too. Sounds like there's some confusion over the facts.

From what I gathered, by the way, the RAID-like storage ensures that data is always stored on two separate physical disks. So that would confirm the suspicions on point 4.

Also, apparently WHS can function as a backend for Apple's Time Machine as well. Hmm..

webmonkey
How am i supposed to code with theeeeeese ?

Dr Herbie wrote:

I am singularly unimpressed.

Do we really need more people leaving PC boxes switched on 24 hours a day, using electricity all the while? Shouldn't we be more interested in technologies that reduce power consumption for home PC users (as well as business PCs)?

Who is the target audience here, anyway? I know hardly anyone with more that one PC at home. If you've only got one PC do you really need a server for it?

Herbie

Exactly!

The idea of it is great but encouraging people to leave the server and computers on overnight to backup is such a waste of electricity and pretty irresponsible.

I wasn't impressed with Gates's comments to the bloggers he met with yesterday about energy efficiency either.

Having said that, i've been looking for a very low powered, backup/server solution for a while and this could have the potential to be that. With simplified hardware this should be that, but we shall have to see.

I like the concept, perhaps not the implementation.

Bas
It finds lightbulbs.

So basically you don't like it, but at the same time it may be exactly what you're looking for?

Stephen

A 'brief' fact sheet for WHS

http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/events/ces/docs/WHSFS.doc

Dr Herbie
Horses for courses

Bas wrote:
So basically you don't like it, but at the same time it may be exactly what you're looking for?

I think he meant that if it could be made to use minimal electricity it would be what he was looking for.

Could an embedded device be set so that it would only wake from highly reduced power usage on network use or scheduled actions?
That would reduce the issue, but even leaving things on standby currently tends to use more power that most people imagine.

Herbie

webmonkey
How am i supposed to code with theeeeeese ?

Dr Herbie wrote:

Bas wrote: So basically you don't like it, but at the same time it may be exactly what you're looking for?

I think he meant that if it could be made to use minimal electricity it would be what he was looking for.

Could an embedded device be set so that it would only wake from highly reduced power usage on network use or scheduled actions?
That would reduce the issue, but even leaving things on standby surrently tends to use more power that most people imagine.

Herbie

Well wake on lan could do just that, <1w for the server, you'd have to wait for it to boot then unfortunately.

But if it were cut down and specialised hardware it should be possible to make the boot pretty instant like any other consumer electronics device.

webmonkey
How am i supposed to code with theeeeeese ?

Bas wrote:
So basically you don't like it, but at the same time it may be exactly what you're looking for?

I like the idea of it but i'm not sure about the implementation yet.

We will have to wait and see what they are like when released, perhaps it will fit my needs exactly, the only thing I don't really like about it is the power consumption and suggestion for people to leave computers on all the time to backup.

I'd also like it to some other things, but that's not a downside to this product, its just my dreams! Wink

EDIT:

Reading that fact sheet it does look very interesting, will be nice to see what AMD come up with, they've been pushing for energy efficiency a fair bit recently - hopefully we'll see a Geode chip in it, don't see why it would need more processing power.

ZippyV
Fired Up

You can use the power settings to shut down the harddrives after being inactive for a certain amount of time and the Intel Core duo processors have the Enhanced Intel SpeedStep® Technology. What else do you want?

Dr Herbie
Horses for courses

ZippyV wrote:
You can use the power settings to shut down the harddrives after being inactive for a certain amount of time and the Intel Core duo processors have the Enhanced Intel SpeedStep® Technology. What else do you want?

What do I want? What I really want is pretty much zero power consumption when not active, though I know that's probably not feasable.

And the moon on a stick.

Herbie

dahat

At first... I was unimpressed... then got 3/4th through the on10 video and wished I had one over the weekend.

As nifty as regular old backing up can be (aka due diligence) ... the fact that it can do a complete system backup daily and that backup be something you can restore from in case of paving or hd death is the very reason why I will be picking up one of those baddies provided their prices is reasonable (ie non MCE, Origami style pricing).

Over the weekend I was forced into paving my Vista machine that’d only been running the RTM for 4-6 weeks and was as a result of something that had chanced (I thought) over the previous ~48 hours... something I couldn’t track down.

webmonkey
How am i supposed to code with theeeeeese ?

Dr Herbie wrote:

ZippyV wrote: You can use the power settings to shut down the harddrives after being inactive for a certain amount of time and the Intel Core duo processors have the Enhanced Intel SpeedStep® Technology. What else do you want?

What do I want? What I really want is pretty much zero power consumption when not active, though I know that's probably not feasable.

It is entirely feasible, has been for years.

My iBook uses 2w when its sleeping, and <25w in use - with a 12" screen.

Why can't a headless cut down machine use less ?

Unless someone can prove me wrong, I wouldn't have thought you'd need a lot of horsepower for a max 10 client (more likely under 5) server doing basic tasks.

Of course we don't know what this uses yet, so we may be suprised Smiley