What’s wrong with Vista? | The Coffeehouse

Skriker V1.0
Need more money...

What’s wrong with Vista, IMHO it’s the best MS OS in years; just don’t install it on 5 year old hardware!

As for Apple, market share up, yeah but how many of those machines are running Vista?

Is there really a difference between Mac hardware and PC hardware, are we not really just arguing about the OS?

“I’m a heterogeneous PC”

spivonious

The only thing wrong with it is that problems weren't addressed early on and Microsoft didn't respond to Apple's ads soon enough. There is a large public opinion that Vista is buggy and slow, which is simply not true, even on five year-old hardware.

ZippyV
Fired Up

Why do you think something is wrong with Vista?

Skriker V1.0
Need more money...

In reply to ZippyV

#Oct 21st, 2008 @ 8:37 AM

Just seems that everywhere I go, here, other forums work and home (Family) Vista had negative reviews, and most are from people who have not even used it.

BlackTiger
If you stumbled and fell down, it doesn't mean yet, that you're going in the wrong direction.

Just bad horoscope... Improper software in improper time...

Dovella
Go Microsoft !!!!!!!

Marketing Marketing and Marketing ,

Vista's image has been deliberately ruined by many "experts" in the sector, probably because Microsoft has not donated money to be doing a good review as other companies teach .

RoyalSchrubber
One. How many time travellers does it take to change a lightbulb?

In reply to ZippyV

#Oct 21st, 2008 @ 8:37 AM

Why do you think there isn't anything wrong with vista? I use it just because it's OS that sucks the least in areas I care, but otherwise Vista is far from dream OS imo.

turrican
Condemnation without investigation is the height of ignorance! - Albert Einstein

Everything is wrong with Vista. Actually, according to some very good "open sources ", it is due to Vista that we don't have world peace yet!

Tongue Out

Just kidding, Vista is great. XP was great. It's just history repeating. People bitched about XP, now they * about Vista... and lately, many of the Vista haters I know have starting using Vista and guess what?... They are starting to * about how Windows7 will suck.

Smiley

Dovella
Go Microsoft !!!!!!!

In reply to turrican

#Oct 21st, 2008 @ 10:09 AM

With WIndows 7 certainly not wait for SP1 , works well from day one

intelman

Perception is what is wrong, and a few bugs. When a major feature like instant search doesn't work as expected or advertised, something is wrong.

Defcon

There's nothing 'wrong' with Vista as a modern OS. However it is far far removed from the the vision its designers and developers intended, and what they showed at PDC 03. This happened due to a variety of reasons - the Reset, decisions to abandon huge features like WinFS, not using managed code (perf problems too) etc.

But reasons don't matter. The end result is an OS which is merely good, not excellent, not stellar. And those are things we should expect from a company with as much talent and resources as Microsoft. And so should they.

InkMaster
Extraordionaire

In reply to Defcon

#Oct 21st, 2008 @ 12:31 PM

Wow, I still remember PDC 03 - I was 14 at the time and I can't even express how excited I was watching all those demos and listening to all those promises. And you gotta admit, at the time, what they were showing off was truly revolutionary. So I'd have to agree with you, there really nothing is wrong with Vista and to the general public its a great OS, but to us, who are interested in technology and who were following the development process of it for years and years, I think its us that are disappointed the most not even because of what it is, but what it could've been.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tf29haATORQ - Who still remembers that video? Exciting times those were Smiley

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Q7xZ2ACyg0 - This was byfar my favorite clip though

Dovella
Go Microsoft !!!!!!!

In reply to InkMaster

#Oct 21st, 2008 @ 12:49 PM

Now we are going to write a new page in the web, and is called Windows 7.
Stop talking PDC 2003.

Wellcome PDC 2008.

BlackTiger
If you stumbled and fell down, it doesn't mean yet, that you're going in the wrong direction.

Some personal thoughts about Vista's failure/"failure"...

It reminds me one "theory". And that theory is "Microsoft is created by developers and exists because of developers".
Not because of customers or consumers aka 'end-users'. End users, actually absolutely don't care. Not because of 'shareholders'.
Yes, it sounds like "Microsoft was 'created' by software pirates". But...

Look what MS did - they promised a lot of cool stuff. 'Cool' only for developers, actually, because other 'consumers' don't care. And?... And nothing in result. Broken promises... 'Broken' for developers, because 'end-users' again don't care. So, 'failure' is developer's revenge and reminder for MS. - "Don't care about customers, even about 'corp.'es. Don't care about marketing. We are, developers, your 'marketing'. We, developers, can break any customer's 'opinion' and turn it into any direction." Not true? What about 'servers' success?

PaoloM
Hypermediocrity

In reply to BlackTiger

#Oct 21st, 2008 @ 1:35 PM

What?

littleguru
<3 Seattle

In reply to PaoloM

#Oct 21st, 2008 @ 2:03 PM

I'm also having a hard time to understand what he actually meant with the post...

AndyC

Having just started a pilot roll-out of Vista, I'm more and more impressed every day. It's not just the big things, but the little nuances here and there which really help make life more productive. I can't stand using the XP/2003 version of ADUC any more having discovered the many subtle tweaks in the new version.

Is it perfect? No, but then neither is XP. Still looking forward to more improvements with Windows 7! Smiley

BlackTiger
If you stumbled and fell down, it doesn't mean yet, that you're going in the wrong direction.

In reply to PaoloM

#Oct 21st, 2008 @ 2:03 PM

What "What?"?

When people from MS will understand my post then... Never mind, doesn't matter...

stevo_
Human after all

In reply to BlackTiger

#Oct 21st, 2008 @ 3:12 PM

No honest, I struggled to read that.. I think you are trying to suggest vista had lots of cool developer stuff, like apis - but no real implementations of that (ala wpf?)..

Microsoft knows empowering developers indirectly empowers the users, but I'm not sure if I agree that vista was 'plenty of abstract with no concrete'..

I think the primary role of the OS is to enable powerful development.. the OS should also give the average user a base line experience, vista had movie maker, media center and all that junk.. and even that they were under pressure to remove because its unfair to competition (aparently)..

Edit: if anything I think 7s role should be to bring a bit more unification to the platform.. make developers proud to design an app that 'fits' windows.. os x is generally pretty consistent, and they make developers happy to make apps that fit in with all that.. of course theres a worry about a platform becoming stale if your only real input for change is the os builder.. meh I'm glad I don't have to develop windows.. its all very complex.

figuerres
???

In reply to PaoloM

#Oct 21st, 2008 @ 2:03 PM

I think I might understand but not for sure...

think about the whole MS story, a *LOT* of MSFT was based on building new stuff that only a few folks really understood. and so many things were built so fast that average joe's won't get.

to contrast the Mac story in the early days was "anyone can use this nice box"

the Apple Ad's tend to focus on simple, quick,fun, cool.

not that MSFT does not work on the UX and such...

just that for many folks the MSFT image is kind of "Hard Core Geek Tech"

PaoloM
Hypermediocrity

In reply to BlackTiger

#Oct 21st, 2008 @ 3:12 PM

Well, we tend to speak English around here.

Koogle
I'm a Terminator - Astalavista, Vis7a!

What’s wrong with Vista?

Sounds like the type of question you might overhear coming out of a conference room at MS... you must also be oblivious to such things as to think the only reason vista isn't liked is because of ads and people installing vista on old hardware lol. Yes cus everyone out there who can't stand vista has old PC hardware from a manufacture who's not really that bothered about making good drivers for the latest and greatest OS.

"Vista had negative reviews, and most are from people who have not even used it."

I used to have those feelings that vista looked and seemed sh/t when I hadn't even used it.. but then I did try it.. I learnt a good lesson.. always trust your instincts, and sometimes judging things from screenshots isn't always such a bad thing to do Smiley

So what’s wrong with Vista?

-Explorer - For such a key part of the OS, that in itself could have pages written about why its so incredibly sh/t and useless in so many areas.. good job on the vista improvements MS ..ps that status bar just ain't big enough.. can you add some more height to it please? And that command bar.. just luv the customization and all the different shortcuts you can add, and quick mouse functionality you can get from it, really great feature.

i love this vista explorer screenshot.. this is beautiful.. its also bit like using flipping3d when you're trying to navigate to that particular explorer folder but trying to look at the sh|tcrumb bar for the folder title Smiley best to leave those things out, wouldn't want the title and that crap white fluffy shadow behind it ruining these clear windows.. wonderful stuff.

-Startmenu - yup great just don't install too much cus you'll be doing plenty of slow time scrolling.

-Taskbar - wonderful progress and enhancments to windows management..

-UAC Prompts, and file transfer dialogs and everything associated, boo noob crap... like I want "more" file transfer info showing(for what little extra info you do get ..pff teracopy tbh) ..ooh dejavu moment.. I swear I clicked that more info button last time. oh well lets click it again.. yay i hope it prompts me with that big fat ugly noob looking replace file dialog.

and lets not forget Areo and all the great uber crapness it brings to all applications and such things as consistancy among running desktop apps.. I think even Adobe thought it looked so crap they've already started on making there CS4 software not adhere to system OS visual styles anymore.. I'm sure they'll get around preventing the dialog windows from using vista ugly defaultlyness theme and buttons soon enough. CS5 perhaps. besides the sooner creative users are using there Bridge * instead of explorer the better, wouldn't want to give explorer users proper working non buggy file thumbnail support when we can force them away from using it.

check this out...you can go from a transparent window to fullscreen maximised black! magical.. damn why can't xp do this?, it looks great Tongue Out

So what's good about Vista

+not much really .... its not totally bad.. just not that great either, nothing a customized XP doesn't already have.
+it has a site dedicated for vista fans to take screenshots of all there favourite areas and features http://www.aerotaskforce.com

+so ...unless you have low standards for UI & UX and don't use much in the way of better third party enhancments, cus like some don't work effectly under the awesomess of vista.. cough strokeit
+ if you have more than 4gb ram you should definetly go vista64 cus like its sooo much better than xp64 and like none of those small selection of issues above, are still around its a totally different wonderful experience and you'll see much more 64bit stuff.
+plus helps if you got a poor eye for good design, you'll love vista, highly recommened stuff.
+ I forgot to mention its got great security.. that windows defender service .. incredible, this thing totally spots & stops sneaky trojans, told me all about its file location, even removed my desktop background and disabled a few things to let me know, and what with UAC always jumping up protect you, from yourself.. can't go wrong.

cheong

In reply to littleguru

#Oct 21st, 2008 @ 2:06 PM

In short, "Care more about what developers think because we have influrence on how the public feel about a product. Vista lose lots of features we developers think is COOL, so we think it's BROKEN, and the public think it is BROKEN".

Do I get the meaning correct?

Bass
www.spreadfirefox.com/5years/

It's slow.

(Please don't hurt me.)

Ray7

In reply to PaoloM

#Oct 21st, 2008 @ 3:29 PM

I understood what he's saying and he does have a point.

The reason that Vista is such a hard sell, is that normal folk cannot see much in it to get excited about.

Microsoft came at the whole problem from a developer's perspective, without actually paying much attention to the consumer. By the time it had landed, stuff that could benefit the consumer (hell, could benefit everybody) had already been stripped out, leaving just a warmed over upgrade to XP (sorry, but this is how consumers see it). The biggest, most visible user-facing change was the WGA which Microsoft then (and I couldn't believe it when I saw it) tried to sell as somehow being advantageous to the user.

Interestingly enough, Apple has added some new anti-customer stuff to the new Macbook line; moisture detectors inside the cases that they will no doubt use to squirm out of their guarantees - the difference is that they're not trying to sell it as consumer feature.

The Vista interface is rife with inconsistencies, which at best are just a minor annoyance, but at worst, make it look like Vista was cobbled together from left over bits of defunct operating systems. The Control panel is a real mess.

What BlackTiger was saying, is that your DNA as developers means you bend over backward for developers, but have not really done so well for the actual consumers.

Now contrast this with Apple, who look at everything from a consumer point of view. This causes a huge amount of pain for their developers, but the end result is a cleaner user interface and more consistent applications.

I'm certainly not going to say that Cocoa is more advanced than .NET (it isn't, sorry Mac fans) and ObjectiveC is so far behind C# it isn't even funny ... but from this duff old framework, Apple developers continue to produce some of the finest, most innovative applications on the market.

See if you can find anything on the Windows platform that can match this. The easiest most consumer-oriented way to create a website that I have ever seen.

Or this. This app is driving writers and academics to purchase Macs in droves. They guy who wrote it is a teacher and amateur writer. Not a developer. His fixation with providing the best UI possible is legendary.

The reason that Mac apps look up to date and actually match the current version of the operating system is because Apple forces its developers to keep up with the platform. This is a pain for the developers, but makes life much easier and richer for the consumers.

Apple has more or less announced that Carbon is over; this is a disaster for Adobe and I can't imagine its good news for the MS Mac division (though I suspect that Apple will leave the old 32-bit APIs in place just to run Office, which I think will be eventually superceded by something that will keep up with the platform).

Life on the Windows platform is much easier for the developer. Crusty old APIs are left in place, which mean that I never really have to do anything aside from minor routine maintenance. So you end up with inconsistencies and no real UI innovation.

The same apps that run on Vista will run on XP, and run on Windows 2000 and will probably run on Windows95 ... so again, there is little incentive from a consumer point of view to move upwards.