Posted By: phunky_avocado | Apr 25th, 2005 @ 4:30 PM
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phunky_avocado
phunky_avocado
Dude! It's the (grilled) cheese.
As this is our little window into Microsoft, thought I share this:

I just got a note from my mole at MS that says her dept. just handed down a mandate saying employees need to give four weeks notice before taking a day off (e.g., a three day weekend) and one extra week for every additional day on top of that. 

That's crazy if true.  She wouldn't lie to me though. 
theseanster
theseanster
Geek on the Beach (not a drink)
Seems fine. If you need a two week vacation, let someone know ~3mo ahead of time. For single days if you don't have enough time to give notice...call in sick.  Wink
3 1/2 months ahead of time for a 2 week vacation seems a little OTT to me.
Charles
Charles
Welcome Change
This type of thing depends entirely on an employee's specific team's policy.

I feel for sorry for your molefriend. That's a drag.

C
I've seen worse. It's a tough world out there.
why do you care? Some people just find ANYTHING to * about Microsoft...


Michael Griffiths
Michael Griffiths
Fatalism.
That's not unreasonable.

But.

It's atrocious that it's in written form. That immediately makes it more inflexible. Now, there should be good communication between the manager and the employee, which leads to notice times of that length.

Yes, you should - as a simple matter of curtousy and thinking ahead - notify your manager that you're taking a two week vacation around 3 months beforehand. However, the arbitray policy of a month before a three-day weekend and the one week-per-day on top of that is really rather sad.

It's another example of creeping beurocracy which, while sometimes useful, eliminates the point - or usefulness - of good managers. And generally kills innovation, fun, freedom, etc, on the job.

Sorry.

I think this is a horrible decision, however. Why the hell does the department head need to make a policy like this? Isn't there such a thing as trust for employees? Specifically, this should be up to each individual manager for each individual person on each individual team. "Equality" is not fair; fairness (and, incidentally, good management) is about extending to the individual (employee) what they need - which wil, naturally, vary from person to person.

Really. I suppose this proves, at least, the oft-repeated claim: Microsoft has bad middle manageemnt. Good people? Maybe. But making bad decisions.
Michael Griffiths
Michael Griffiths
Fatalism.
gman wrote:
why do you care? Some people just find ANYTHING to (I need to watch my language) about Microsoft...


Happens in alot of other companies, as well.

Bad decisions have a way of becoming very popular... typically because it's harder to make the "good" decision. Bad decisions try to make things easier, but lose perspective.

For instance, this department head sounds like she(?)
s trying to make life easier for her and the database. Scheduling, project management, resource availability. Reduces planning overhead, and helps to limit "crunches" (too much work for a smaller amount of people).

Certaily a good motive. And one that she should, really, work towards. However, beurocracy is never the way to do this. Ever. (Not really true, but it's true in a vast majority of cases, so a rule is better).

Instead, the department head should leverage her lower-level managers to communicate the status of the project, ensure that the necessary work is accomplished, and work around that. That's what managers do (in part), and that's what they're paid to do: make everything run smoothly.

Each additional step of paperwork, each additional rule or regulation, acts as a roadblock for the manager. It reduces the manager's freedom, their ability to work around the project. Plus, it makes it harder (slower, more expensive, and less efficient) to do what the rules say; I doubt, for instance, that the manager has calculated the incremental cost of this new decree. What is the impact on employee morale, how does it affect the overall image of the company? It might (and probably is) be widely out of proporation with its signifiance. For instance, the department head may have drawn the ruling from the average amount of notice they have. What is the cost of processing each piece of paperwork, and where does it redirect the decision to? Is the decision the direct manager's? How much does it cost in employee time to fill out the form, gain the requisite information, and is it up to the department head to figure out if this overloads other employees, or what?

It *seems* like a simple solution to the problem the department head, and other project managers, are facing. But the problem is what it does the the process. By solving one problem, you've added in many more - some unforseen. And it becomes even easier to compound the error, because the temptation is to try and "fix" these new problems with the same process: more beurocracy.

You'd think they'd teach these things in Management 101. God knows it's in every management book every written.
Vacation policies vary from team to team and group to group. In many cases, individual managers set the tone.

I've never heard of a policy such as the one you describe, which seems to me to be completely unworkable.

At Microsoft, treating your team like that is a good way to have them leave and find a different manager who will treat them better.

I prefer to have as much notice as possible for long vacations because it affects schedules significantly. But that's about it. Only rarely have I ever asked anyone to adjust a planned vacation for business needs, and in those few cases it's been a mutual coordination type effort.

As for three day weekends, I don't care. I've got bigger things to worry about. People on my team take a day off when they feel like it. It's not even a matter of "approve or disapprove". Many times, if it's a person on my team who isn't my direct report, I'm not at all aware of those kinds of vacation days.

Tensor
Tensor
Im in yr house upgrading yr family

I think if people actually read contracts in most places of work, they would find somthing similar in there. Its certainly in mine, and mine is pretty bolierplate.

The thing is, where the rubber hits the road, if I need to take a day off, I can do it. In my experience, thats the way it usualy works. I dont think it would be possible for me to actually give 4 weeks notice for every day off I need!

msemack
msemack
Embedded Systems Guy
That does seem pretty long.  In my company, it's 30 days notice (for vacation time).  For vacation periods in excess of 5 days, you need to give 90 days notice.  Personal time isn't subject to that requirement, but you can only use 1 day of personal time.

Ultimately, it depends on resource planning.  If you're going to be gone for a week, and you're a critical member of the team, management needs to know about it so they can work around it.

Immagine someone important from the Longhorn team deciding to take 3 weeks off a month before the RTM!

I guess if the department is on a really tight deadline, or resources are stretched thin, I could see implementing this policy.  It could also be someone on a power trip, though.

Still must suck for the employees...
rhm
rhm
I chose to work for Bruce!

[ooo, just reading your blog. Ironman triathlon, are you sure about that?!]
In most cases these rules aren't really written in stone. It's usually more a case of you won't get a "No" if you put in the appropriate amount of notice (assuming cover is availble, if necessary).
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