Chris Jones - Beta 1 of Windows Vista revealed

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Description

Today Microsoft is signing off on beta 1 of Windows Vista. There's a big party on campus and all that. Betas will soon be available for MSDN Universal, Enterprise, Professional, and Operating System Subscribers.

As usual, we (Robert Scoble and Jeff Sandquist did the interview) wanted to get the straight scoop so we went to Chris Jones, who is a corporate vice president tasked with building and shipping a high quality Windows Vista product. He tells us what's in beta 1 and what to expect at the PDC.

We had a little fun with Chris and made him put a quarter on the table everytime he said the word "Longhorn."

He explains the build process for Windows Vista and gives us a demo at about 11 minutes into the interview.

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The Discussion

  • User profile image
    DuNuNuBatman
    Cool, when do I get to download it... or do I have to wait for the torrent Wink
  • User profile image
    Andre Da Costa
    Its available to MSDN Subscribers before the Technical testers, which is quite strange.
  • User profile image
    scobleizer
    John Montgomery has more details on his blog about beta 1.
  • User profile image
    Manip
    AHH! The video is taking *so* long to download! COME ON!
  • User profile image
    Tom Servo
    Hey, Chris Jones, why's the bits not on MS Connect?
  • User profile image
    Chadk
    Notice the 9 guy in the background! Wink

    But Congratz with the beta1!
  • User profile image
    jphillips59
    pretty odd, maybe there have been issues with connect?
  • User profile image
    Manip
    Was it just me or did he just reveal there is going to be a home and a pro version?

    Two things, no.1 I got from what he said that it will no longer do "dumb searching" which is a *must have* as a developer. I want to search a *.dat; a *.bmp file for strings when I do a search. It requires a frigging registry hack in XP to get it working.

    Secondly did anyone else notice how long it took his files to appear after the window did?

    Where, as a user, can I disable this automatic error reporting? Can I?
  • User profile image
    sven_kraemer

    oh this video is very very good, i just can't wait for testing it on my own!

  • User profile image
    Larsenal
    I hope manip isn't right about the lack of dumb searching.  Please don't make me install Agent Ransack again, Microsoft.
  • User profile image
    maxharris

    I didn't notice it at first, but did Chris say PDC '93 instead of 2003 a few times near the end of the video?

    I keep thinking, "1993 wasn't that long ago".

  • User profile image
    BenZila
    Ask how many lines of code are in vista and XP.
  • User profile image
    scobleizer
    >Ask how many lines of code are in vista and XP.

    I've asked that before. They don't know for sure because there's so much code all over the place being compiled into it.

    We're going to get a tour of the build labs and we'll ask that question again and see if we get a better answer.
  • User profile image
    randomeleme​nts
    Looking good Smiley Can't wait for my invitation to finally go "Active" after being sat on Pending for over a week.
  • User profile image
    eddwo
    At 00:21:15 Did I just hear that right?
    WinFX is not installed in Windows Vista by default?

    Oh its "On the disk, so you can install it if you want", .Net 1.1 was "on the disk" for XP SP2, but it didn't really help the roll out of the framework to the general population.

    So you want to deploy one of those nice "(Avalon) Express applications", a single click on a web link and it is supposed to download and launch within the browser frame, but wait, "Additional componants required, Please locate your Windows Vista install media"

    Hardly a great user experiance.

    So .Net is IN Vista, but Avalon and Indigo are only optional installs?

    WHY?
  • User profile image
    jujitsu_sic​kness
    The prices for MSDN subscriptions are a bit steep for me...

    Is there a place where I could buy *only* Vista beta 1?  Or even better, will beta 1 be released for free to the general public at some point?
  • User profile image
    scobleizer
    >WinFX is not installed in Windows Vista by default?

    Where did you hear that? WinFX and .NET, Chris said, were included in Windows Vista. Where did you get that?
  • User profile image
    scobleizer
    >Is there a place where I could buy *only* Vista beta 1?

    Nope, sorry. Only MSDN for now.
  • User profile image
    eddwo
    So the is a Vista Tablet PC edition, but how will it be delivered. At the moment Tablet is restricted to OEMs and MSDN(not for production use).

    If Vista Tablet is restricted the same way it means you will NOT be able to buy an upgrade to Vista for an existing TabletPC. Not very supportive of the existing user base.

    It definitely sounds like the Tablet features, TIP, Recognisers etc are not going to be included in every Vista version, and are still restricted to Tablets only. I didn't really expect them to be included considering the OEM price of Tablet is well above that of standard XP.

    What I do hope is that there is at least support for inputting and editing INK on non-tablets, maybe the equivelent of having the Tablet SDK installed by default. Or will that come through WinFX as well?
  • User profile image
    HellSnoopy
    Awesome video ...
    I want to get into the beta Sad Who do I send female strippers to ? *lol*
  • User profile image
    eddwo

    scobleizer wrote:
    >WinFX is not installed in Windows Vista by default?

    Where did you hear that? WinFX and .NET, Chris said, were included in Windows Vista. Where did you get that?


    At 21 minutes and 10-30 seconds into the video.

    Cos there was a lot of confusion on the blog..

    The the Whidbey version of the .Net framework is in Windows Vista, it's out there. And WinFX comes along with Windows Vista, its on the disk, people can install it if they want to install it and use it, so it will be around with every copy. And, the nice thing about both Whidbey and WinFX is they are available downlevel for Windows XP. So...

  • User profile image
    MikeSan

    Nice Video. Although the fact that Chris has a hammer and some Scotchtape directly behind him for most of the video, doesn't do much for my confidence in the build. LOL!

  • User profile image
    z2bass
    You said this was just revealed.... this was reported by Paul Thorrott reported this long before this video.  winsupersite.com

    i think beta 1 should be on a mass distribution scale so they can get a lot of feedback for a great OS. But i bet Beta 2 will be distributed in mass quantities as many MS products are.
  • User profile image
    notuptome
    i want to know about gameing on Vista and how it will optimize Windows  Vistas  new UI  when loading  any  game that requiers a beefy graphics card as well.
  • User profile image
    Seldon_21

    Ok, trying to download and we have a problem.  What was the bandwidth calculation for this release?  Why not torrent the thing and be done with it. 

    Still need a key.

    Still need to register your copy. Here is a link to what I am seeing. Still trying.....

  • User profile image
    BenZila
    scobleizer wrote:
    >Ask how many lines of code are in vista and XP.

    I've asked that before. They don't know for sure because there's so much code all over the place being compiled into it.

    We're going to get a tour of the build labs and we'll ask that question again and see if we get a better answer.


    Coolios, the amount of code that must go down in Redmond just boggles my mind.

    Heres another question that i've been wondering.

    If with longhorn we are on build 5xxx and each increment = a day, why is XP only about half that? Was XP done super fast?
  • User profile image
    amazzitelli
    Hi, I from Argentine and....I´m a IT Pro here but I´cant access to a MSDN Suscriber by the high cost of it and I want access to Beta 1 for download like all you. I logged in at http://connect.microsoft.com but there isn´t any beta program.

    is there any GuestID for Windows Vista?

    Thanks
  • User profile image
    eddwo
    The build numbers are continuous through the whole NT line, they do not start at 1 for each version.

    See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_NT#Releases

    So NT4 was 1381
    2000 was 2195 (814 builds in 4 years)
    XP was 2600 (405 builds in 18 months)
    Vista is at 5112 (2512 builds in 4 years)

    Though of course it doesn't work like that, the numbers are fairly approximate.. They  rounded XP up to the next 100 and Vista skipped from 4xxx to 5xxx with the Longhorn "reset"

    -- Yay I'm now "Active"/
    Should have this thing downloaded in time to try it after work tomorrow.
  • User profile image
    TDude
    amazzitelli wrote:

    is there any GuestID for Windows Vista?
    Unfortunately there isn't.
  • User profile image
    Pimp Daddy
    Great video - although for a minute when Chris Jones was talking about VBLs, I thought he meant Vista had been secretly done in Visual Basic.NET. Now that's a scary thought! (I'm a VB.NET fan, but it's not for OSs). Fortunately I got my brain into gear a few seconds later!
  • User profile image
    s_jetha
    I have a few questions:
    1. I read a while ago that the whole searching thing behind Vista was going to be available for download to XP, but I think that someone got confused between WinFS and WinFX (which is the whole top level API thing Chris was talking about). Is this true? Did someone mis-read and decided to tell the world before sourcing it properly?

    2. What is Whidbey? I've not heard of it, personally and was just wondering if someone could clear it up for me.

    Thanks Wink
     Shafiq.
  • User profile image
    BenZila
    Whidbey is visual studio 2005

    And I think most of the search technology is what was developed for the MSN desktop search but was just "integrated" better.
  • User profile image
    amazzitelli
    the guys from Channel9 could help us to get beta1 download. Can they add a beta download section on this page?

    This is very important for us, the IT Pro get it now for test and send a feedback too.

  • User profile image
    amazzitelli

    I want the Scobleizer´s opinion. No, Robert? Wink

     

  • User profile image
    scobleizer
    I'm simply swamped with stuff right now. I'm trying to find out if we can expand the beta, but for now the answer is that it's on MSDN for subscribers. Sorry.

    That said, there's a thread over in the coffeehouse and I'm watching that. Hint hint. No promises.
  • User profile image
    amazzitelli
    thanks Robert, This is very important for the IT Community.
  • User profile image
    will
    eddwo wrote:
    What I do hope is that there is at least support for inputting and editing INK on non-tablets, maybe the equivelent of having the Tablet SDK installed by default. Or will that come through WinFX as well?


    Was just looking around at the MSDN Windows Vista website and saw the following:

    Windows Vista includes many advances for Tablet PC developers. Chief among these are Ink Analysis and integration with the Windows Presentation Foundation, formerly code name "Avalon". Probably the biggest advance, however, is the ubiquity of Tablet PC features. To date, developers have had a difficult time with the Tablet PC technology redistribution problem. With Windows Vista, however, Tablet PC technologies are ubiquitous across all Windows Vista editions.


    via: http://msdn.microsoft.com/windowsvista/mobile/#tpc
  • User profile image
    CRPietschma​nn
    What are the system requirements for WinVI?
  • User profile image
    scobleizer
    The main one I've heard is that if you want to see all the features you'll need a 128 MB video card. Other than that, it seems to run fine on my two-year-old Dell.
  • User profile image
    amazzitelli
    Hi, who know if WindowsVista will be the client OS for LonghornServer (blackbomb) 2007/2008 or will be another client OS? WindowsVista R2 with winFS?
  • User profile image
    scobleizer
    Windows Vista is the client OS. I just talked with Iain McDonald and he says that the next server version will be Server 2007. They are still arguing over the name. But, there'll be a server version out a little while after Windows Vista client ships.

    After that? Who knows? Too far out. Let's get Windows Vista out the door before we start speculating on Blackcomb or whatever else will come after that.
  • User profile image
    scobleizer
    Orbit: your system should run Windows Vista just fine. Of course there'll be cool new systems out next year that'll blow that away, but you don't need them to have a nice experience with Vista.
  • User profile image
    notuptome
    scoble what type  of home system and  office computer  system you running.

     and also could you tell me  is the  start menu and all menus related to task var  and windows   in start menu and right clik menus   run throught he graphics card  as well or are they  the  only things still  CPU run
  • User profile image
    staceyw
    I am interested in the new Network stack.  What is new besides IP6 (I thought 2003 had IP6 already?).  Is it WinSock3?  Does it have more or better socket support?  Is the .Net support better?  Async model changed?  Threading model?  Is there a link to the detailed changes/additions?  Thanks much!

    --
    William Stacey [MVP]
  • User profile image
    leighsword
    scobleizer wrote:
    Orbit: your system should run Windows Vista just fine. Of course there'll be cool new systems out next year that'll blow that away, but you don't need them to have a nice experience with Vista.

    i hope so, windows vista only is an OS (someone like me use it just for work), not a stupid game that needs lots of RAMs of video card to perform.
  • User profile image
    cregdan
    What the heck is Vista based on these days? I can't get a straight answer.. It has to be either XP SP2 or 2003... Which is it?
  • User profile image
    notuptome
    2k3 SP1  code 
  • User profile image
    The J
    In my experience, people always blow the specifications needed for an application out of proportion. This is definately seen with games. For example, people thought that Doom 3 would never run well unless you have a GeForce 6800 and 2GB of RAM, and even then you couldn't play it at max settings. It turns out that it runs on high settings very well with a Radeon 9700 Pro. I can run it on Ultra settings with 4x AA and all the eye candy enabled at 1024x768 with a GeForce 6800GT and 1GB of RAM. My point is that there's no need to worry about an OS running on a P4 2.4GHz or a Radeon 9800. I can see some having trouble with an unoptimized beta, but the RTM version I just can't see someone needing to buy a GeForce 6 or ATi X800 series card just to run Windows and see the Avalon display engine in action. Chances are that any DirectX 9.0-compliant card (Radeon 9500 and above; GeForce FX 5200 and above) will do fine.
  • User profile image
    ChrisChance

    its basedof 2k3 sp1 code after the latest rewrite...

    c9... can u guys get a interview with the team in charge of the new winsock... in the groups (thehive and on other sites i talk to techs) theres alot of confusion over the new tcp stack and winsock....

    there was discussion previously of rewrites of the new tcp stack so that it wouldnt do the cutting packets in half every failure and stuff like that to take better advantage of broadband connections but after a slight mention of it atleast a year ago no real communication has been done with the winsock team... i'd really like to see a light meeting with whoevers incharge of the winsock development.... i mean you did kernel and now vista general why not winsock?

  • User profile image
    scobleizer
    We already have an interview setup with the folks who are working on the new networking stack.

    Most of the work was done to natively support IPv6.

    What questions do you have for the team?
  • User profile image
    Tyler Brown
    scobleizer wrote:
    We already have an interview setup with the folks who are working on the new networking stack.

    Most of the work was done to natively support IPv6.

    What questions do you have for the team?
    Scoble, does this include Network Location Awareness? I've been trying to get some new information for some time, but haven't been successful. I even emailed John Stewart on the NLA team last week, but haven't received any form of response. Not sure if he's on vacation, busy, or not employed with Microsoft anymore.
  • User profile image
    Larry​Osterman
    BenZila wrote:

    Coolios, the amount of code that must go down in Redmond just boggles my mind.

    Heres another question that i've been wondering.

    If with longhorn we are on build 5xxx and each increment = a day, why is XP only about half that? Was XP done super fast?

    Each increment isn't a day (to be honest, I'm not sure what the increment period is).  And the builds reset - the Vista Beta1 builds were the 5000 series, Beta2 has a different number, etc.
  • User profile image
    Steve411
    Blah.

    Steve.
  • User profile image
    keeron
    Steve411 wrote:
    Blah.

    Steve.


    Wow! that reply must have taken some thought!

    (seeing how I might waste my reply as he did ... here's something useful)

    Robert, now that beta1 is out - can you try to (I know its a big task) run a series of interviews again with the Avalon/Indigo team, kernel and memory management teams? Go over some of the changes they did in Longhorn  Windows Vista?

    Also, just to ask the question again (asked few replies earlier) - is Avalon/WinFX and .NET integrated in the build or available as a separate installer? (beta 1 build I mean)

    (my installation is still going on... it will be a big night, I'd have to install Whidbey afterwards)

    - Keeron
  • User profile image
    bonk
    Andre Da Costa wrote:
    Its available to MSDN Subscribers before the Technical testers, which is quite strange.

    Why do you find that strange ?
    Why should the people that pay get it later than the people that don't ?
    I find that perfecty reasonable and adequate Smiley
  • User profile image
    Deactivated User

    Comment removed at user's request.

  • User profile image
    RamblingGeek​UK
    Manip wrote:
    Where, as a user, can I disable this automatic error reporting? Can I?


    This can be done in XP. Right Click My Computer > Properties > Advanced > Error Reporting [Button] > Disabled Error Reporting [Radio Button].

    HTH.

    Downloading WinV now @ 21%...... thinking I need a dedicated PC to run...?
  • User profile image
    moofish
    It might now be up but I can't find any news groups to ask questions on Vista, the only ones are hardware related on the MS site, does anyone know if there is going to, for example, a Vista Genral Newsgroup?

    I ask because I will not be able to test the OS itself.

    Samuel, UK
  • User profile image
    Roginator
    What happened to the visual effects seen in the first screenshots of "Longhorn", such as the sidebar, the alt-tab which moved windows in 3D, etc?

    Was this dropped when they switched to the new code base, or is this meant to be put back in a future beta?
  • User profile image
    amazzitelli
    I believe that if Microsoft let us to access to the beta program of Vista early, we can test the OS and it´s better for MS to have more feedback. How much people test it, the OS will be more sure. There are a big community of developer and IT Pros that can test it before than the home user ship it.

    Scobleizer can you lead a project to create a Betaplace community on Channel9 Site???.

    Thaks.
  • User profile image
    Maurits
    Chadk wrote:
    Notice the 9 guy in the background!


    Yup Smiley At least two - one on the (huge) whiteboard and one next to the phone.

    Curious - what percentage of intra-Microsoft communication is via phone, email, IM?
  • User profile image
    ChrisChance
    Ok i guess what i want to know is did they get to go through with the optimizations to improve overall throughput? I remember there was talk of Intellectual property issues that might have stopped them from doing it but what has been done to improve performance over the winsock / tcp stacks?
  • User profile image
    Zolk

    This standard user thing is not going to work. Most users today simply don't understand the importance of PC security. People are not going to know about the difference between an administrator account and standard account. If all Vista user accounts are admin by default, most people will never know to change that.

    Furthermore, the average user will just blindly input their password anytime they're prompted and end up installing who knows what on their systems. I hope this isn't Vista's only defense against spyware—Microsoft needs to make a lot of under the hood changes to prevent spyware from overtaking a system in the first place.

  • User profile image
    Maurits
    LUA won't stop users from infecting themselves with spyware.  But it will make sure they don't infect other users.  So Mom will get much less spyware by giving Junior a limited-user account.  (And vice versa.)
  • User profile image
    littleguru
    Great video Smiley I'm looking forward to test vista beta 1
  • User profile image
    GrumpyWookie
    Great clip - some interesting stuff.   Seems like everyone is trying to get used to the "new name"...

    What exactly is a VBL ?   (Vista Build Library ?)

    Interesting white-board discussion of the build aspect.  Just wondering what exactly was "reverse integrated" - lots of DLLs & so forth ??
  • User profile image
    amazzitelli
    Orbit86, I say that Microsoft can create a Betaplace for the IT pro and developer or expand it because only a few people can access to a beta program, why you think it´s sounds like Open Source?
  • User profile image
    iain

    vbl stands for virtual build lab.  we have central build lab && a set of second level labs (usually org based) that do a put all the changes that have happened for a period of time in at one go.  it allows us to keep the core build super solid, && have teams work off by themselves without the rest of the world hosing them. originally we would only have 1 level of vbls below core. now we have multiple levels of vbls. reverse integrating is the term we use for putting stuff from the vbl into the main lab.

    we didn't know about the vista name back in 1999 when this was created. we still had neptune & odessey as separate projects - some idiot went off to create whistler && blackcomb as project names. longhorn came out of that...

    /i

  • User profile image
    dentaku
    I've been thinking about what's gonna happen when this product finally ships and I'm wondering whether or not Vista will be released on DVD? It would be much handier than CDs.

    PLUS: Even with all the best HELP documents in the world, a free instructional DVD would go a long way towards teaching the general public how to use the full power of their OS and have them realize that computers aren't "magic" but just another dumb machine that need to be taken care of.

    The problem with being the most popular OS in the world is that you end up having the largest number of totally clueless users in the world and they're the people who mess up everything. I know companies don't want to ever tell their customers "it's your own fault you mess up your computer" but by having a DVD to teach people who to use their shiny new OS responsible/creatively/efficiently it would help out people like me who have to always run to their rescue when something goes wrong.
  • User profile image
    Tyler Brown
    Roginator wrote:
    What happened to the visual effects seen in the first screenshots of "Longhorn", such as the sidebar, the alt-tab which moved windows in 3D, etc?

    Was this dropped when they switched to the new code base, or is this meant to be put back in a future beta?
    The sidebar was dropped some time ago, and won't be back apparently. I'm not sure about the 3D Alt-Tab interface... this is Beta 1 so perhaps it will be back in Beta 2?
  • User profile image
    BlackTiger
    Smiley

    Very good and useful equipment on the shelf! Smiley

    Looks like hammer or axe...

    Is this for Vista developers or for end users? Or for beta testers?
  • User profile image
    Tetrachroma​tic
    I'd love to watch this, but I'm on a PowerBook. Will this work on WMP9? Or is this encoded with WMV3? Also, how about encoding in a format that everyone can use or, I don't know, have your software support your own (I need to watch my language)ing file formats?
  • User profile image
    scobleizer
    >Will this work on WMP9?

    It works on the Macs here. Are you using the latest player? Also, Macs work better with the download file (click the "save" link underneath each video).
  • User profile image
    moofish
    yea... so does anyone know when/where the forum for Windows Vista will arive, I'd like to start asking questions as soon as possible
  • User profile image
    Tyler Brown
    I believe it's being taken into consideration, the forums that is.
  • User profile image
    GoldenEye

    I dont think you need a very fast computer at all to run this. Vista is running better for me than XP ever did.
    I can actually have adobe photoshop cs 2 open, and it will not lag down all my other applications or my desktop.

    I have penitum 4 2.6ghz with 384ddr ram. So my pC isnt the fastest and Vista runs nice and smooth on it.

    I think alot of people will find this OS incredible. Especially how much better its going to be in its final release.
  • User profile image
    NewXStar
    I like Windows Vista

    Microsoft Released Windows Vista Beta 1 (Screenshots)

    ********************************************
    Windows Vista Beta 1 Installation Screenshots

    ********************************************
    IE 7 beta 1 download
  • User profile image
    Avalon
    Scoble, why have you never done a video on the graphic design team at Microsoft?  I know that you obviously couldnt show any conceptual designs for any new user interfaces, such as vista itself, but if you think about it, it's these guys that are actually helping reshape the future. I remember watching a video on winsupersite from i think it was pdc 2003 which showed some concepts from Vista and thought that they looked so amazing. Now its pretty well known that Microsoft have something up their sleeves which we may see in beta 2, or rc1 or may not even see until the final release next year. I'd like to know more about these guys that are working on this amazingly new UI, and hear them talk about the work that they've done and what is ahead. Id like to know more about the team, and hear them talk about the things they have designed in the past. ie, Media player 10, media center, why the ui change in office 2003 etc and where the hell did they get that longhorn grass from??! id just like to hear them talk about things, like how different is it to work with avalon and so on and on..

    They obviously knew about the vista name before many of the main vista development team because they had to come up with the vista motion videos and graphics in advance.

    Im not being critical of your work, infact, i cant get enough of it! but you have to admit, most of the videos we see are from the 'development' side of microsoft. Its always good to see what else goes on at microsoft. i loved the video you did of the recruitment process for instance. I cant think of a better video than one of the Graphic design team.

    How about it??!

    For anyone else who's interested, you can find out a little bit more about the microsoft designers here http://www.microsoft.com/resources/design/people.html
  • User profile image
    Andrei P

    GoldenEye wrote:

    I dont think you need a very fast computer at all to run this. Vista is running better for me than XP ever did.
    I can actually have adobe photoshop cs 2 open, and it will not lag down all my other applications or my desktop.

    I have penitum 4 2.6ghz with 384ddr ram. So my pC isnt the fastest and Vista runs nice and smooth on it.

    I think alot of people will find this OS incredible. Especially how much better its going to be in its final release.

     

    Same here. The PC I installed Vista on doesn't even meet the minimum requirements, and it still runs way better than I expected. It seems to even access the HDD less than XP does, and most of the applications run smoothly.

    For those of you who don't have access to Vista, I posted 19 screenshots at http://www.geekpedia.com/software38_Windows-Vista-Beta-1-Screenshots.html.

    Though, it's a pity you can't see the animations.

  • User profile image
    eddwo

    Vista behaves very strangely on my machine. It's really slow/jerky/unusable, except when it's running the CPU flat out.

    I had to install Seti@Home and run that in the background, to keep the CPU at 100%, so I could use the system at all. With Seti running its really smooth and snappy, it seems faster than XP and downloads go much faster.

    As soon as the processor drops below 100% its back to being all jerky again. When its jerky the system clock also runs too slowly. When watching the control panel clock applet, it ticks about once every 7 seconds.

    Must be a problem with the chipset driver I think. Something low level anyway.

  • User profile image
    Mixpower

    I have Windows Vista Beta 1 now for a while,
    But i can't make it work with my Raid Controller Sad

  • User profile image
    ascent
    Cool Video....but Windows Vista ?

    I think that name is terrible! I agree that is important that MS shift away from numbers and letters (98,2000,ME,XP) and towards a friendly marketable name (ala Tiger). I just don't know that "Vista" will resonate well with consumers. 

    Anyone else think they would have been better off shipping "Longhorn" as Longhorn?
  • User profile image
    billh
    Andrei P. wrote:
    For those of you who don't have access to Vista, I posted 19 screenshots at http://www.geekpedia.com/software38_Windows-Vista-Beta-1-Screenshots.html.


    Thanks for the screenshots...but I am struggling with one main design question...why are the title bars transparent? Other than to make the window take on a more "glassy" look?  It seems like it is now more difficult to read the information in that part of the window.  I'm also struggling with the fact when I look at numerous screen shots it takes me several seconds to figure out what every little link/breadcrumb/button is for...it seems like a step backward in terms of intuitiveness.  I know, it's only "developer beta" but this trend seems strange.  Maybe it is something a user gets use to, who knows.
  • User profile image
    Andrei P

    Dialog boxes, maximized windows and certain other windows don't have the titlebar transparent. I believe that with a transparent titlebar you can focus more on the what's in the window, disregarding the titlebar (which you rarely look at).

    Also, they added an interesting blur effect so that the text in the titlebar can be readable.

    First I was a bit confused with Virtual Folders, then I got used to them. It shouldn't take long for the typical Windows XP user to accommodate to Vista. The basic operations like simply browsing for a file and other routine tasks are still similar to the previous Windows operating systems.

    One of the graphic effects I like most on Vista is when you hover over the minimize, maximize/restore and close buttons in the titlebar. I updated the page and added screenshots with this effect.

  • User profile image
    ZippyV
    Chris Jones = Michael Suyama from the Northwind database (2003) ?
  • User profile image
    Andrei P
    Hey, one other thing. I was browsing the C9 forums with IE and it seems that pages load much faster (considering my connection has only 44 KB/s). Anyone else experiencing that using Vista's IE 7?
  • User profile image
    arunpv
    Check this latest on WinVista....

    CNET User Reviews for Microsoft Vista, average ratings by 4.9/10:

    http://reviews.cnet.com/Microsoft_Windows_Vista/4505-3672_7-31456587.html?tag=lst

  • User profile image
    Andrei P
    No wonder. There are lots of Linux zealots and other Microsoft haters that hunt these reviews and hijack them with comments and bad ratings. You can see them everywhere, here, on Robert's blog, on MSDN, on Neowin, and so on. They have nothing better to do between kernel version updates.
  • User profile image
    arunpv
    Andrei P. wrote:
    No wonder. There are lots of Linux zealots and other Microsoft haters that hunt these reviews and hijack them with comments and bad ratings. You can see them everywhere, here, on Robert's blog, on MSDN, on Neowin, and so on. They have nothing better to do between kernel version updates.


    It has nothing to do with Linux zealots or MS haters, Its a review by CNet and users who like/dislike MS/Apple/Linux comment on this.
    These reviews are an eye opener taking user inputs and making the OS better is a good thing,  see things in a broader view and not as criticizing then things will better. Probably you didn't have anything to do other than reading the review and commenting like this.

  • User profile image
    Andrei P

    "The interface and features are not as good as Mac OS"

    "Bow down Microsoft give in to anyone with a little cash(IMHO). Really; I am glad that there are GOOD alternatives out there, IE Linux, BSD, and even the Mac. Take back your computer and enjoy feeling the freedom and empowerment that comes from using an alternative OS. Try Linux, it is always free, free of cost and free of viruses, spyware, tcpa, and drm. Also most every program you could want, good programs can be downloaded and used for free. Try www.PCLinuxOS.com, or www.ubuntu.org, or www.mepis.com"

    "Microsoft is going to catch up to Apples current technology and features... in over 1 year. By then Mac OS X and Linux will be years & years ahead. Again. "

    Yes, that was really enlightening. I am quite curious to find out how you find these and 70% other similar reviews, "eye opener".

    Also, no one sane enough rates an operating system lower than 4. I don't think there's any operating system deserving less than 4 out of 10. Most of the reviewers on CNET rated Vista 1, 2 or 3. Not to mention reviews such as "I can create Windows Vista at home using skins", reviews which clearly come from someone who only judges by seeing a couple of screenshots.

    And when Apple launched Tiger, why weren't there any Microsoft zealots posting reviews such as the ones I see now on CNET: "Who needs it? I wonder, who needs it. It is not going to make my customers pay their bills faster, it will not make them accept higher prices...". With this kind of perspectives you'll not be going far my friend.

    I'm convinced now. No matter what Microsoft is going to do, biased reviews will always exist. And there will always be someone to hijack  forums and blogs with their unconstructive, obsesively repeating comments. Microsoft enthusiasts don't join Linux or Mac forums talking about how great Windows is. If Linux or Mac was that great, it would have the OS market by now. The same way Ford lost in front of Toyota on the US market recently.

  • User profile image
    soundint

    When is the Public Beta 2 version going to be available?

    Also, what torrent site has the Beta 1 version available for download?

    thanks...

  • User profile image
    dotnetjunkie
    Andrei P., I'm really happy to have you here on Channel9. Not only are your views correct, you save me a lot of time too, because you already said all the things I wanted to post! Smiley

    Oh, and thanks a lot for the nice webpage you put together, I'm definitely going to show it to my colleagues tomorrow!

    Windows Vista is going to be fantastic. I can already begin to feel the excitement, and I'm sure I'm going to fall in love with it, just like I did with XP all those years ago...
  • User profile image
    dotnetjunkie
    Avalon wrote:

    For anyone else who's interested, you can find out a little bit more about the microsoft designers here http://www.microsoft.com/resources/design/people.html


    Good idea!

    Then Robert should interview this guy!!!
    http://www.microsoft.com/resources/design/people_tjeerd.html

    Oh, and he's from The Netherlands, very cool Smiley



    Although I could understand if he prefers to have a chat with Nadja Wink
    http://www.microsoft.com/resources/design/people_nadja.html

  • User profile image
    scobleizer
    I'm working on an interview with him.
  • User profile image
    johnbrien

    Can anyone tell me where I can get a good copy of Microsoft windows vista I have look all over the place for it. But cannot find a copy for love or money.


    If anyone can think of where I can get a copy of it

     

    Please e-mail me at johnhbrien@hotmail.com

  • User profile image
    radams31768

    Did you ever find out where we could download Win Vista.

    I am itching to try it.

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