IE 8: Dev Tools - An Introduction with John Hrvatin

The Discussion

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  Dev tools are very cool, will be looking at these more tomorrow at work..

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  Spread the word: IE8 beta 2 is Sweet!

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  i only installed and use it for less than 5 minutes ..it looks just like ie7 ..i dont know what they could have changed but it would been nice if it looked a bit different ..
  
  i must admit ..i currently dont use windows and ie so i dont know if this is changed and thats why i am asking ..a while ago, when downloading a file, ie will download it to a temporary area and then move it to its destination when the download is complete ..this is mostly ok when downloading half a kilobyte of a file but very annoying when trying to download a large file especially when running out of disk space on the default downloading drive ..is this behavior changed? ..
  

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  I scanned through the interview but I couldn't find any video demonstration of the new Developer Tools, I'd like to see an IE team member demonstrate the CSS editing features because when I use it, it just seems like a complete, non-functional mess. I would rather use the original IE Developer Toolbar for editing CSS, hopefully I'm just missing something with the new tool.
  

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  CSS line-height is a lot more complex than John alludes. Try running this demo in various browsers to see the CSS 'normal' values applied for various font faces:
  
  http://meyerweb.com/eric/css/tests/line-height/inspect-multi.html
  
  It is certainly not the case that IE, Opera, WebKit do the same thing and Firefox does something else.
  

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  We will be doing some deep dives on the dev tool components in the near future. This conversation was an introductory piece, not a tutorial (there will be Screencast tutorials on MSDN as well in the near future).
  
  C

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  "If standards are the same for everybody, where's the value add for an IE or a FF, etc.?"
  
  It's a false choice.
  
  The standards only have to do with how a page is rendered. If all browsers had to do was render pages, the question would be a valid one. But it's a false argument - there are all kinds of things that a browser does Other Than render pages.
  
  From a presentational developer's standpoint, I don't care if default line height is 1.2 in one browser and 1.0 in another, because if it's a problem, I'll set line height to the explicit number.
  
  No, the problem isn't default line-height, the problem is that when I make an explicit style rule, that it hasn't made the same result across browsers. Padding: 10px should look like 10 pixels of padding in FF, IE6, IE7, IE8, Opera, Safari, etc., not 10px in FF and Safari and 20 in the IEs.
  
  Also, pick one, and force everybody to switch. No reason on Earth I can think of that IE7 wasn't a critical update at release. What you do when you don't make people switch, is to allow people to be contrarian about the fact that they don't have to switch, and then they just don't.  That may allow one set of developers to preserve code base, but it kills everybody else.
  
  That results in more work for the presentation layer people, which is why those people don't take you seriously. And that's sad, because the more your latest browser gains acceptance and market share, the more presentation people can be confident that the code they write is cross-browser compatible.
  
  Win, win.

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  I would've watched the presentation but you hadn't yet convinced me why I should download Silverlight. 

  
  

  "Unsafe JavaScript attempt to access frame with URL http://analytics.live.com/Sync.html?V=3486 from frame with URL http://channel9.msdn.com/posts/Charles/IE-8-Dev-Tools-An-Introduction-with-John-Hrvatin/. Domains, protocols and ports must match."

  
  

  
  

  Yeah. Good luck with IE8.  Make use of those Dev Tools while you're at it.

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  very cool, thanks!