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Looks like WinFS is back on track.

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  • User profile image
    Andre Da Costa

    It seems like development of WinFS is ramping up again just in time for PDC 2005, plus a recently released beta to MSDN on monday.

    From Microsoft Watch

    Many had written off Microsoft's next-generation Windows file system as little more than vaporware. But sources say the first WinFS beta code is to come within a month.

    When Microsoft announced a year ago that it had decided to rip the next-generation Windows File System (WinFS) from Longhorn, many company watchers wrote off the feature as little more than vaporware.

    But it seems Microsoft didn't simply shelve WinFS. According to sources close to the company, Microsoft just last week put the finishing touches on the first beta release of WinFS. And the company is moving ahead with plans to back-port the WinFS technology to Windows XP, the same way that it decided to do with the Windows Communication Foundation (Indigo) and Windows Presentation Foundation (Avalon) Windows subsystems.

    Read the rest here

    From CNET Blogs

    Microsoft on Monday posted the first test version of a new Windows file system.

    The company made the test version the file system, called WinFS, available to subscribers to its Microsoft Developer Network service.

    The software was originally intended as a key feature of Windows Vista--developed under the code name Longhorn--the next release of the operating system expected somtime next year.

    However, roughly one year ago, Microsoft announced that it was removing WinFS from Vista and would release it separately in order to meet its delivery schedule for Longhorn.

    Microsoft says WinFS will make it easier to find information stored on both local PCs and across networks.

    "WinFS bridges the gap between file systems and databases and provides a unified, rich programming platform for all data: structured, semi-structured, and unstructured," according to information posted to MSDN on Monday.


  • User profile image
    Michael Griffiths

    It's been common knowlege that Microsoft planned to release the public Beta of WinFS the same time Longhorn shipped (which Cnet mentioned). It would be available as a download.

    Has that changed? Is Microsoft now intending to include WinFS in Windows Vista?

    If now, I fail to see why this is suddenly splashed across the "news".

  • User profile image
    blowdart

    WinFS is supposed to be on MSDN?

    Errr, tosh.

  • User profile image
    jmacdonagh

    This is great news! I really want to see WinFS!

    Michael Griffiths wrote:
    It's been common knowlege that Microsoft planned to release the public Beta of WinFS the same time Longhorn shipped (which Cnet mentioned). It would be available as a download.

    Has that changed? Is Microsoft now intending to include WinFS in Windows Vista?

    If now, I fail to see why this is suddenly splashed across the "news".


    The difference is, it looks as if WinFS will RTM the same time Longhorn will. Microsoft was promising Beta 1 for the Longhorn RTM, but they're ahead of schedule.   

  • User profile image
    irascian

    blowdart wrote:
    WinFS is supposed to be on MSDN?

    Errr, tosh.



    This is just the latest example refuting the constantly repeated claim that "professional journalists" are more reliable than the average blogger. Expect it to be repeated in the printed journals next week.

  • User profile image
    blowdart

    irascian wrote:
    blowdart wrote:WinFS is supposed to be on MSDN?

    Errr, tosh.



    This is just the latest example refuting the constantly repeated claim that "professional journalists" are more reliable than the average blogger. Expect it to be repeated in the printed journals next week.


    And ewww, the new MSDN interface sucks. As for the speed ... 38 hours to get the lastest MSDN library? Good lord. I'd be quicker looking on BitTorrent

  • User profile image
    Sven Groot

    Beer28 wrote:
    Remember Win98 when you got a bad driver, and it would reboot into checkdisk, take 2 hours to complete, only to mess up, and reboot again into the same checkdisk????

    Fortunately we have NTFS now, where that never happens.

  • User profile image
    Andre Da Costa

    It looks likely that it could come bundled with the RTM of Vista if they are already able to get it to BETA 1. PDC 2005 is definitely the conference to watch. Smiley

  • User profile image
    irascian

    blowdart wrote:

    And ewww, the new MSDN interface sucks. As for the speed ... 38 hours to get the lastest MSDN library? Good lord. I'd be quicker looking on BitTorrent


    There's something very odd going on with downloads. I started with about 256k/sec and then suddenly it dropped to about 38K/sec. So I hit Suspend and then Resume and it came back to 256k/sec. I'm downloading August CTP of VS2005 Team System edition and it's happened a couple of times the same way. I have no idea why hitting suspend and then resume should kick it into the faster download rate when it deteriorates, but this method is working for me.

  • User profile image
    blowdart

    irascian wrote:
    blowdart wrote:
    And ewww, the new MSDN interface sucks. As for the speed ... 38 hours to get the lastest MSDN library? Good lord. I'd be quicker looking on BitTorrent


    There's something very odd going on with downloads. I started with about 256k/sec and then suddenly it dropped to about 38K/sec. So I hit Suspend and then Resume and it came back to 256k/sec. I'm downloading August CTP of VS2005 Team System edition and it's happened a couple of times the same way. I have no idea why hitting suspend and then resume should kick it into the faster download rate when it deteriorates, but this method is working for me.


    I've seen that a lot. It always starts at well over 100 then drops. I get the sneaking feeling that the load balancing is geographic and the european servers are just bad and slow and no-one actually cares because there are more US subscribers.

  • User profile image
    Tom Servo

    Beer28 wrote:
    I wonder how winFS is going to measure up against LVM and Journalized ext formatted volumes.
    APPLES AND ORANGES! APPLES AND ORANGES! APPLES AND ORANGES! And you damn well know it! Shut the (I need to watch my language) up instead of derailing every goddamn thread into your freakin' annoying Linux bullshit!

    Andre Da Costa wrote:
    It looks likely that it could come bundled with the RTM of Vista if they are already able to get it to BETA 1. PDC 2005 is definitely the conference to watch.

    I doubt that it'll be available as RTM when Vista goes final. Remember, this is a data storage technology/platform, it has to undergo more testing than Vista itself maybe. Because the last thing Microsoft wants is having it suffer from amnesia.

  • User profile image
    blowdart

    It's there now, under SDKs. Must have taken a while to move to the Europe servers.

    WinFS Beta1 (English)

    Date/Time Posted
    2005-08-29 09:56:55 (UTC)
    File
    en_WinFS_Beta1.exe ISO-9660 CD Image
    File Size
    76 MB
    SHA-1 Hash
    f519ef6d000a922993cc0033ab01f7e4415e980f
    Description
    WinFS is the codename for Microsoft’s next-generation relational file system for Windows. As an essential piece of Microsoft’s Integrated Storage strategy, WinFS bridges the gap between file systems and databases and provides a unified, rich programming platform for all data: structured, semi-structured, and unstructured. With WinFS, Developers will be able to use its unified Item Data Model across applications, present new relational organization constructs for data, and create applications that exploit data more powerfully. WinFS is a development platform that will improve developer productivity and reduce organizations’ time to market.



    Now I wonder what version of the framework it needs Smiley As if it's not bad enough keeping VS and SQL in sync

  • User profile image
    blowdart

    Oops, documentation link is there, but the file isn't

    Perplexed

  • User profile image
    TimP

    As far as I know, WinFS will run on top of NTFS. As Sven pointed out, NTFS is already a journalled file system. Now assuming they base the database on SQL Server, they'll have SQL Server's built in support for transactions. Therefore, if your system dies in the middle of an operation, the file system will repair anything it needs to when it reboots and when the WinFS database service starts it will roll back any uncommitted transactions.

  • User profile image
    blowdart

    TimP wrote:
    As far as I know, WinFS will run on top of NTFS. As Sven pointed out, NTFS is already a journalled file system. Now assuming they base the database on SQL Server, they'll have SQL Server's built in support for transactions. Therefore, if your system dies in the middle of an operation, the file system will repair anything it needs to when it reboots and when the WinFS database service starts it will roll back any uncommitted transactions.


    You're assuming that the data is actually stored in a database. I don't believe that's the case, the database is there to make relationships and object schemas for the underlying files. You're not going to see the contents of c:\windows inside a database, but what you would see is your Outlook contacts in there, shared between applications.

    I'm waiting for the documentation download to be available

  • User profile image
    blowdart

    Tom Rizo blogs that it did go out earlier than planned Smiley

    Tom! FIX THE DOCUMENTATION DOWNLOAD! Tongue Out

  • User profile image
    TommyCarlier

    Orbit86 wrote:
    Tom Servo wrote:
    Beer28 wrote: I wonder how winFS is going to measure up against LVM and Journalized ext formatted volumes.
    APPLES AND ORANGES! APPLES AND ORANGES! APPLES AND ORANGES! And you damn well know it! Shut the (I need to watch my language) up instead of derailing every goddamn thread into your freakin' annoying Linux bullshit!
    have some manners dude..or kill yourself, Beer just points out what was wrong with previous versions of Windows, nothing wrong with that

    When I read Beer28's post, I actually thought exactly the same, although not that extreme. Here's a post about a MS technology that hasn't even been released yet, and the first thing Beer28 posts about it, sounds like this: it will probably be crap, if you compare it with the filesystems used in Linux.
    And Orbit86: you start your post with have some manners dude, and then you tell Tom: or kill yourself??? How do you like puberty?

  • User profile image
    blowdart

    Actually what makes me wonder is what happens when you copy a file, replete with meta data from WinFS to a network drive ...

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