Coffeehouse Thread

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  • User profile image
    oscar2

    Hi all, I really appreciate participating in your forum and will start my posting with new information.
    After the tragic attack on 9/11 and the war on terrorism, Islam remain the fastest-growing religion in America and in the world although religion is no longer dominates everyday life in Western society.

    http://www.therevival.co.uk/revivalissues/september11_and_conversions.htm
    http://www.cnn.com/WORLD/9704/14/egypt.islam/

    "Islam is the fastest-growing religion in America, a guide and pillar of stability for many of our people..." Hillary Rodman Clinton, Los Angeles Times, May 31, 1996, p.3

    Famous people too:

    Singer "Cat Stevens"   Oh, baby, baby it's a wild world
      Hear his story as told him

    http://www.sing365.com/music/lyric.nsf/singerUnid/E94AFB9F1279780B482569BA0007D998

  • User profile image
    oscar2

    From what I've heard from different friends of mine who have converted to Islam, there are a few main reasons for most conversions:


    1. Muslims and Christians agree that God is self-existent.  This means that He does not derive his existence from anyone. also they both believe in Jesus, love him, and honor him. In fact, no Muslim can be a Muslim unless he or she believes in Jesus, on whom be peace.

    The Quran teach that Jesus is prophet or messenger from Allah and not a God so Quran denies the divinity of Jesus.The Qur'an says that Jesus was born of a virgin, that he spoke while he was still only a baby, that he healed the blind and the leper by God's leave, and that he raised the dead by God's leave.

     
    2. Islam is a religious lifestyle, not just a quick Sunday morning church visit and a label. Although some Christians do pray before each meal and spend much time with their Bible, etc.many don't in the USA. Islam is something that can't be shunted into a few spare hours. You pray five times a day. Your dress code is affected; even your food choices are explained in the Qur'an. Many converts like it because they feel actively involved and as if they are truly religious.Some people also studied Buddhism, flirted with Roman Catholicism or spent time with Quakers, but ultimately found them lacking.


    3. For women, it is a big and welcome change from the "in your face" sexuality of western culture. Women are not required by the Qur'an to veil. They are required to dress modestly and it is *recommended* that they cover their hair. However, most do veil and some go farther with niquab (the face screen) or other traditional clothes. Women dressed like this consider themselves marked as religious women, not easy dates. They don't get hit on. No one gawks at their bodies. They are clearly off limits sexually and many that I personally know say it is liberating not to have to conform to western standards of sexy dress, makeup and spending so much time and money on appearance. You buy a five-dollar hijab, put your hair in a ponytail and cover, wear long skirt and a tunic shirt -you're set.


    4. Islam is also growing because many people are not satisfied with Christianity. They feel it is too liberal, too fluid and changes for the culture. Islam on the other hand is more rigid and does not as a whole allow much for modern changes and the whims of society. Many like it because they feel other religions have loose standards.

    A person like me who is unfamiliar with Islamic teachings might be surprised to hear that Islam does not rely upon blind faith to make its case, but rather, encourages to use minds. For example, the Qur'an invites to ponder upon the wonders of creation, and challenges with intellectual arguments. Further study of the Qur'an demonstrates that sound reasoning and scientific knowledge confirm rather than contradict authentic revelation and its ability to satisfy the intellect whilst bringing peace to the soul.

    That's what I got from the new Muslimah's group at Yahoo, Islamway women's board and a few other friends of mine. Stats taken by many college groups say that women convert 4 times more often then men.

  • User profile image
    dotnetjunkie

    Huh, shouldn't you rather post this on a political or religious forum?

    For us, there's only one religion, and that's the Microsoft evangelism Wink

  • User profile image
    oscar2

    Sorry what I beliefe is that "natural inclination for religious faith is an integral part of the human essence. This is an indisputable fact of history. All scholars of comparative religion, regardless of their own religious backgrounds, agree that religious belief is a natural human condition. They differ, however about its origins"


    the human being has a natural tendency to seek out something to worship and that there is a natural feeling that this object of worship must possess greatness.

    pagan societies always worship a plurality of beings – never restricting themselves to worshipping, for example, one mountain or one star – is an indication that man, in reality, naturally seeks an overwhelming Higher Power and compensates for this by taking a collection of deities. This shows that he feels a need for a power outside of his natural environment that he can turn to when all the material powers around him fail.

  • User profile image
    dotnetjunkie

    Sorry but I don't have that tendency, it all depends on where you live on this earth, the environment in which you grew up etc...  Over here, religion doesn't matter for the majority of people anymore, less than 5% of the total population still goes to church, and especially young people don't believe in a god or something. We just don't feel the need for it.

    This doesn't mean however that religious traditions like funeral or marriage don't happen anymore, we now have "religion à la carte", people pick what they like, and reject all the rest.
    You can find the relevant studies and numbers on the Internet.

  • User profile image
    JChung2006

    I nominate this thread for "vaguest, most misleading title."

  • User profile image
    W3bbo

    JChung2006 wrote:
    I nominate this thread for "vaguest, most misleading title."


    Yeah, I thought it was a thread about Channel9's CSS document Wink

  • User profile image
    oscar2

    dotnetjunkie,

    If you go by how many new places of worship are popping up, then sure Islam will win - Christianity is an established religion, and has so many feckin' churches, that if they built any more, they would probably out number houses.


    You cannot steer people's personal faith. Islam is now a part of western culture, wheither you like it or not. It's not just for people in prison, or rock stars looking for a new thing. Some people just associate with Islam more than Christianity. That does for the other side of things too - 70% or so of Americans are Christians, and although many don't like that, it's just the way it is. It's a fact, it can't be changed, and those people are entitled to follow their faith. Acts in the name of christianity have been responsible for some pretty fuc.ed up consequences in the last 50 years.

  • User profile image
    oscar2

    see islam is a  great thing ..... islam like the sweet if you test it one time , you will never ever leave it ..... i think you got the bad picture of islam  .....  you can visit this site
    http://www.beconvinced.com
     
    there are four parts inside that site ........ you will find the complete picture of islam ..... just choose  and read

  • User profile image
    Tensor

    Yay, Proselytizing. Just what C9 needs.

  • User profile image
    Harlequin

    oscar2 wrote:
    ...then sure Islam will win...


    Welcome to the wonderful world of fundamentalism.

  • User profile image
    billh

    1. So why then was the Curtain torn in two? Between the Holy Place and Most Holy Place?

    2. Don't go to church much I gather.  Since when was Christianity something that could be shunted into a few spare hours?  Some people do that, but not all.  Some pray more than five times a day. Regarding food choices, Paul addresses this in one of his letters, but he was more or less speaking to the Jews of his time in that regard.  You can feel "actively involved" and feel "truly religious"...it all depends on your attitude.  If your personal religion depends on what everybody else around you is doing, well, then you may be in for a difficult time.

    3. Again, how you dress is an individual choice.

    4. Pope Benedict said this also.  The Western Church may have "loose standards" depending on location/umbrella organization, but do not be so quick as to generalize them all.  Again, there is big difference between what your church does and what you personally choose to do.

    oscar2 wrote:
    A person like me who is unfamiliar with Islamic teachings might be surprised to hear that Islam does not rely upon blind faith to make its case, but rather, encourages to use minds. For example, the Qur'an invites to ponder upon the wonders of creation, and challenges with intellectual arguments. Further study of the Qur'an demonstrates that sound reasoning and scientific knowledge confirm rather than contradict authentic revelation and its ability to satisfy the intellect whilst bringing peace to the soul.


    Since when did Christianity rely on blind faith? I take it you have never actually been to any sort of a Bible study...these debates take place constantly.  Free will is very much involved.  I'm not even going to go after you "peace" argument because it is too easy to debunk.

    "Whilst"...hmmm.  W3bbo is that you?

  • User profile image
    Cornelius Ellsonpeter

    oscar2 wrote:
    see islam is a  great thing ..... islam like the sweet if you test it one time , you will never ever leave it ..... i think you got the bad picture of islam  .....  you can visit this site
    http://www.beconvinced.com
     
    there are four parts inside that site ........ you will find the complete picture of islam ..... just choose  and read


    Why is it when I go to that site it crashes my PC and places itself in my bookmarks?

  • User profile image
    Harlequin

    Cornelius Ellsonpeter wrote:
    oscar2 wrote: see islam is a  great thing ..... islam like the sweet if you test it one time , you will never ever leave it ..... i think you got the bad picture of islam  .....  you can visit this site
    http://www.beconvinced.com
     
    there are four parts inside that site ........ you will find the complete picture of islam ..... just choose  and read


    Why is it when I go to that site it crashes my PC and places itself in my bookmarks?


    <DanaCarvey_ChurchLady>
    The work of...
    Satan?!?!?!?
    </DanaCarvey_ChurchLady>

  • User profile image
    Mohammad Jalloul

    Although I hate to reply to this post (it really does not belong here), I feel it is necessary to mention a few things:

    1) Obviously, oscar2, not only are you young, but also really naïve.
    2) It is also obvious you have no idea what you are talking about. It seems obvious you're a victim of the cut-n-paste syndrome. Before you quote someone, from some website or book, try to investigate.
    3) You do not know what Islam is; you won't recognize Islam even if it was right in front of you.
    4) It's funny that you mention Islam and women. Isn't Islam the religion that allows a man to be married to up to 4 women at one time? Hmmm, does not seemsvery fair to me. What do you think oscar2? Have you ever read about the inner details of being a Muslim? Do you know how unfair Islam is when it comes to inheritance and the percentages divided upon the male and the female? Of course not. You haven't got the slightest clue.
    5) Your comparison of Islam to Christianity to show that Islam is a "better" religion that "wins" is a clear indication that you are on your way to becoming a fundamentalist Muslim if you ever convert. 
    6) You say "A person like me who is unfamiliar with Islamic teachings might be surprised to hear that Islam does not rely upon blind faith to make its case". You have NO idea what you're talking about. It does. It does.
    7) Sadly, Islam, like all other religions, has a lot of loopholes. It is those loopholes that allow people like Bin Laden to easily brainwash the minds of youngsters like yourself who are fascinated by the hype surrounding Islam and convince them to do things in the name of Islam.

    Finally, you seem to be a dudette, "oscar2", and not a dude. It cool to read and learn about other religions. However, don't take everything you read as a fact. Investigate. Research. The truth is out there. You need to have an open mind, not a naïve one. What you mentioned (or copied) touches only the skin. You need to go beyond that. And.... good luck.

    Just my 2 pennies...

  • User profile image
    Cybermagell​an

    Mohammad Jalloul wrote:

    However, don't take everything you read as a fact. Investigate. Research. The truth is out there.


    Yeah it's in Afghanistan...I'm sorry but I've tried to avoid posting on this thread because of the topic...I suggest if you want to get a first hand look at how the teachings work you go talk to these people..



    After two years out there I seen enough (and more than I wanted to.) and for the people who think I just sat around...I was assigned to these guys

  • User profile image
    oscar2

    There are more peaceful Muslims than there are extremists Muslims. So.....the religion is not to blame, but the people are. Hitler played off German Nationalism, so are Germans to blame? Or was it the (I need to watch my language)s? You are being close-minded and reactionary, and that perpetuates the cycle. Most Islamic societies aren't theocratic. I find it interesting that the three largest Islamic countries have had women heads of state (Indonesia, Pakistan, Bangladesh), while the same can't be said of the three largest Christian countries. [[ Violence against women : Husbands or boyfriends murder three women each day in the United States. And more than 700 women are raped or sexually assaulted every day ]]   The so-called freedom of western women and childhttp://www.quietmountainessays.org/WHRB.htmlhttp://canow.org/vafacts.htmlhttp://web.amnesty.org/actforwomen/scandal-index-eng MY BODY IS MY OWN BUSINESShttp://www.jannah.org/sisters/naheed.html Women in Christianity and Islam   (see the difference):http://www.jamiat.org.za/isinfo/wchristian.html

  • User profile image
    Cybermagell​an

    Before anyone answers to this...

    It's old (Oct 22) and IMO is something that shouldn't have been resurected.

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