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Is Vista a failure

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  • User profile image
    rjdohnert

    Considering the bad press, hardware issues that some people even myself have had with Windows Vista and the fact businesses are staying away from Vista for now.  Would you guys consider Windows Vista a failure and for you devs that worked on Windows Vista \, what would you have changed if you had the chance?

  • User profile image
    eagle

    No, the sales figures speak for themselves. Corporations that haven't yet upgraded are planing to soon, System Admins love Windows Vista.

  • User profile image
    Jason Cox

    The exact same thing was said about XP a few years back and look at it now.

    Vista is not a failure.

  • User profile image
    TiAdiMundo

    No. I love it. Sit here with my 12 inch HP tablet with Vista at 120 dpi. Great. Big Smile

  • User profile image
    j0217995

    Just was working with a customer who has 15k clients and they moving from Windows 2000 Professional to Vista, skipping XP.  SO be careful when you say businesses are not moving towards XP, they just move slower, especialy large organizations.  Another 6k clien computer base is just moving to XP from 2k

  • User profile image
    raymond

    Until Microsoft releases Service Pack 1, many larger organizations will not install it.

    Vista will take off in 2008!

    Cool

  • User profile image
    mstefan

    Yup, most businesses are not interested in being on the "bleeding edge" and will wait until a service pack or two is released for the platform before adopting it.

    The biggest problem with Vista (in my opinion) wasn't the operating system per se. It was the third-party hardware vendors that aren't interested in providing compatible drivers for their older hardware. And then there was nVidia and Creative, releasing substandard drivers for months after launch (so bad to the point where they were putting up public statements about how they really are committed to quality Vista drivers, and please just give us more time, yadda yadda...)

    You'd have thought Microsoft had just sprung the operating system on them, with no betas, no release candidates and no RTM build almost two months before launch.

  • User profile image
    kettch

    mstefan wrote:
    You'd have thought Microsoft had just sprung the operating system on them, with no betas, no release candidates and no RTM build almost two months before launch.


    Didn't you hear? nVidia had to rewrite 20 bajillion lines of code from scratch using punchcards in order to work with Vista (or so I read in an interview with their head of development).

  • User profile image
    MB

    Jason Cox wrote:
    The exact same thing was said about XP a few years back and look at it now.

    Vista is not a failure.


    Not so sure corporates avoided XP.

    However, the jump from NT4 to Win-2K (NT5.0) was a painful one that many organisation avoided for ages, and a whole heap of them went straight to Win-XP (NT5.1) instead.

  • User profile image
    CyberGeek

    I don't think it's a failure. Its install base has been steadily climbing ever since launch. I fully expect it to gain well over 50% share of desktop computers at some point. I think that the progress has been pretty good when considering an install base as entrenched as a very large part of the Windows community is. Sure, we haven't seen the entire Windows install base move to Vista en masse, but such an event would be a success of a magnitude never before seen in our industry, and the lack of said event is certainly not an indication of failure (unless, of course, such an unprecedented event was your goal, in which case you might want to consider toning down your expectations a wee bit.)

  • User profile image
    JChung2006

    Its market share is growing, because people are buying new computers and those predominantly come with Vista pre-installed.  Vista and any future version of Windows will be a success as long as people continue buying new computers that come pre-installed with Windows.

  • User profile image
    DigitalDud

    Vista screams on my newish 2 gig laptop.  I'm really happy with the performance and the visual polish.  I haven't had any problems with the OS except for some sleep issues.  That's a lot better than when XP came out.

    Still, I'm sure it would have been a lot better if they hadn't totally screwed up the development.  Although knowing MS, they're probably beating themselves up far more than anyone else.

  • User profile image
    blowdart

    DigitalDud wrote:
    Vista screams on my newish 2 gig laptop.  I'm really happy with the performance and the visual polish.  I haven't had any problems with the OS except for some sleep issues.  That's a lot better than when XP came out.


    But that's because you have new hardware. Like XP there are driver issues on older hardware. I cannot update because Toshiba don't do drivers for my 18 month old laptop. And that's part of the problem with uptake; hardware manufacturers are pushing decent hardware into artificial obsolescence.

  • User profile image
    MB

    blowdart wrote:
    
    DigitalDud wrote:
    Vista screams on my newish 2 gig laptop.  I'm really happy with the performance and the visual polish.  I haven't had any problems with the OS except for some sleep issues.  That's a lot better than when XP came out.


    But that's because you have new hardware. Like XP there are driver issues on older hardware. I cannot update because Toshiba don't do drivers for my 18 month old laptop. And that's part of the problem with uptake; hardware manufacturers are pushing decent hardware into artificial obsolescence.


    Toshiba and Canon have a reputation for not providing new drivers for older hardware. Vista is nothing new there. I clearly recall having the same problem with Win2K and an older Toshie notebook, and I recall having to throw away a Canon multifunction because they refused to write XP drivers for it.

  • User profile image
    BryanF

    blowdart wrote:
    But that's because you have new hardware. Like XP there are driver issues on older hardware. I cannot update because Toshiba don't do drivers for my 18 month old laptop. And that's part of the problem with uptake; hardware manufacturers are pushing decent hardware into artificial obsolescence.
    I'm in the same boat (Satellite R-15); they don't even offer a half-as‍sed exmplanation for why it's not feasible. Sad

    Technologically, I think Vista will be seen as a success in the long run. Compatibility issues will be fixed; as other have said, XP had similar hiccups and Vista introduces significant new changes (for example, in security, driver models, and networking) whereas XP could have been seen as more an incremental, consumer-friendly update to 2k. The reliability and error reporting infrastructure goes well beyond what was there before, so we should see steady improvements with time. Still, there have apparently been some glaring issues with Vista RTM, so instincts to hold off until SP1 are not completely unwarranted.

    Business-wise, it's a bit harder to tell. Now that it's out the door, they'll sell 100s of millions of copies even if they just sat on their hands, and it's hard to call that a failure. Still, the opportunist obsolescence of partners like Toshiba, combined with the byzantine licensing and bland marketing, probably blunted a lot of enthusiasm. Or it could simply be that the industry's more mature and so it's hard to get excited by an operating system, even if there were now technical issues.

  • User profile image
    esoteric

    There're several ways to judge success. Technical, financial and commercial success.

    I don't bother with commercial success, although obviously the company behind it should. Of course one might stipulate that commercial success follows from technical success. But in Windows' role as a platform, commercial success doesn't necessarily follow immediately after release, simply because applications that use its new features, don't yet exist - well not in any significant number.

    Technical success has to be visible for the end-user. It has to be fealt and seen. If not, why should the user feel compelled to upgrade?

    Of course the promise of DX10 will also most likely fuel transitions when games start to appear in large numbers.

    Short term, Vista may be a commercial failure. But long-term, I don't think so. But it may be that some people step over Vista and wait even for Vienna.

  • User profile image
    Rossj

    j0217995 wrote:
    Just was working with a customer who has 15k clients and they moving from Windows 2000 Professional to Vista, skipping XP.  SO be careful when you say businesses are not moving towards XP, they just move slower, especialy large organizations.  Another 6k clien computer base is just moving to XP from 2k


    I am currently working with a customer of about the same size whose first question was 'will your software work on NT?'. They have been on XP/2003 for about 1 year and have no plans to move to Vista in the forseeable.

    My point is that neither of us should extrapolate a general point from our current or recent experience as they are unlikely to reflect the picture in the rest of the industry.  Me having one customer who isn't moving to Vista is not reason enough for me to shoult "Vista is a failure!".  If all of my customers where the same then maybe things would be different, but as you point out it tends to be the biggest (in my experience) that are the slowest.

    I don't think, this far in to Vista's life it is possible to claim it as a success or failure, only that it is going to be the only choice at some point in the future (unless you take the switching pain) and therefore highly likely to be a 'success'.  If you claim success or failure based on the hype, then I would have to side with the failure option.

  • User profile image
    Maddus Mattus

    No Vista is not a failure. How can any software product be a failure? What are the standards for a failed software product?

    The question should have been:

    Are you using Vista?

    Yes I am using Vista. Yes I have had my share of headaches. Yes I had them with XP. But even my girlfriend uses Vista and she is really happy about it.

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