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What's the Recycle bin for now?

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  • User profile image
    Massif

    Given that Vista can do a very good job of maintaining previous versions (including deleted files) isn't the recycle bin a tad redundant at this point?

    We probably need a new metaphor for looking back for deleted files (something to bring deletions and changes under the same umbrella, and ideally something that can keep a track of files being moved too) but if one can be found can we get rid of the recycle bin? (or is it too familiar now?)

    I'm just trying to work out if life would be simpler without the recycle bin now.

  • User profile image
    Bas

    All previous versions of files are lost (for me) when I reboot into XP (so, on a dual boot system). I read the reason why this happens somewhere, but I forgot. But as a result, I still need the recycle bin.

  • User profile image
    Rich2k

    Actually it might be related to this, the issue I'm having.

    I occasionally store temporary files to the desktop e.g. exported an image from Lightroom and want to upload it to say Facebook or my Skydrive.  Anyway I do so, then delete the file, clean out the recycle bin.

    A few days later do the same, the original file is still there according the to file browser in IE when selecting a file to upload, I can still open it too, yet look on the desktop it's not there.  Did I delete the file or didn't I, or did Windows Vista just pretend to delete the file for me?

  • User profile image
    Sven Groot

    I still haven't figured out how previous versions is supposed to work. Despite the fact that the relevant partitions are checked in "System protection" and the fact that I have restore points, no files ever have previous versions. What am I doing wrong?

  • User profile image
    Bas

    Sven Groot wrote:
    I still haven't figured out how previous versions is supposed to work. Despite the fact that the relevant partitions are checked in "System protection" and the fact that I have restore points, no files ever have previous versions. What am I doing wrong?


    Are you occasionally dual-booting into another OS? Because that's what killed it for me.

  • User profile image
    Sven Groot

    Bas wrote:
    
    Sven Groot wrote:
    I still haven't figured out how previous versions is supposed to work. Despite the fact that the relevant partitions are checked in "System protection" and the fact that I have restore points, no files ever have previous versions. What am I doing wrong?


    Are you occasionally dual-booting into another OS? Because that's what killed it for me.

    No.

  • User profile image
    Custa1200

    Sounds like you need some sort of "Time machine" Wink

  • User profile image
    ZippyV

    Sven Groot wrote:
    What am I doing wrong?


    You didn't change them.

  • User profile image
    the_sombrer​o_kid

    anyone who doesn't want vista to keep a huge database of previous versions they will never want or need, will probably prefer to have the recycle bin than not, i am one of those people however i'm not to bothered about loosing the recylce bin because i shift delete everything anyway, which beggs the question was the recycle bin ever that useful? was it always included as an option with little to no negative impact you could choose not to use and if so why remove the option? redundancy works in nature why not in windows!

  • User profile image
    theshadguy

    I actually use the Trash as more of a....scaffold, you know? Like, when I go through my system and clean up a bunch of things, I'll then go to the Trash and look at everything that's about to kick the bucket and make sure I didn't accidentally delete the wrong thing. And plus I can see everything to be deleted in one place..But I see the point

  • User profile image
    Massif

    I had the idea that instead of a Recycle bin, you get more of a "changes explorer" which can be filtered to show recent deletes, recent file moves, recent content changes to files etc...

    Or it can be filtered to show changes that effect a specific file or folder.

    I think something like that would be more useful than Recycle bin is now. Plus it would expose the "previous versions" feature in a more useful way to more people.

  • User profile image
    GoddersUK

    Custa1200 wrote:
    Sounds like you need some sort of "Time machine" Wink


    Sorry, Time computer whent bust a while ago didn't they? Tongue Out

  • User profile image
    the_sombrer​o_kid

    tbh i think you're right about this my grudge with Previous Versions is mostly that it hoardes invisible hard disk space if there was something like this & it wasn't too differant from the recycle bin i would probably use it & clear it out now and again

  • User profile image
    AndyC

    Sven Groot wrote:
    I still haven't figured out how previous versions is supposed to work. Despite the fact that the relevant partitions are checked in "System protection" and the fact that I have restore points, no files ever have previous versions. What am I doing wrong?


    Check the status of the System Restore task in Task Scheduler. Previous Versions is built upon the snapshot technology used by System Restore and so versions are created when restore points get made. If the service is failing or if you've disabled System Restore then there won't be any previous versions available.

    Back to the OT, Previous Versions is by no means a replacement for the recycle bin. It's quite possible and likely that you might create and delete a file between version snapshots - in which case there is no magic way to restore it. Also a high number of large file changes between snapshots made remove recent changes from the previous versions cache. The recycle bin is a much more controlled process and thus you aren't going to lose things by accident.

  • User profile image
    Massif

    AndyC wrote:
    

    Back to the OT, Previous Versions is by no means a replacement for the recycle bin. It's quite possible and likely that you might create and delete a file between version snapshots - in which case there is no magic way to restore it. Also a high number of large file changes between snapshots made remove recent changes from the previous versions cache. The recycle bin is a much more controlled process and thus you aren't going to lose things by accident.


    That may be true today, but there's nothing stopping previous versions from storing every change / delete or move every time a file is changed.

    I'm just wondering whether you might get more out of previous versions if it could be used to replace the (rather primitive) recycle bin.

    Plus, who wants a feature made famous by apple? Tongue Out

  • User profile image
    Dr Herbie

    Massif wrote:
    
    AndyC wrote:
    

    Back to the OT, Previous Versions is by no means a replacement for the recycle bin. It's quite possible and likely that you might create and delete a file between version snapshots - in which case there is no magic way to restore it. Also a high number of large file changes between snapshots made remove recent changes from the previous versions cache. The recycle bin is a much more controlled process and thus you aren't going to lose things by accident.


    That may be true today, but there's nothing stopping previous versions from storing every change / delete or move every time a file is changed.

    I'm just wondering whether you might get more out of previous versions if it could be used to replace the (rather primitive) recycle bin.

    Plus, who wants a feature made famous by apple?


    Because the recycle bin is a good real-world metaphor that most users can understand?


    Herbie

  • User profile image
    Sven Groot

    Dr Herbie wrote:
    Because the recycle bin is a good real-world metaphor that most users can understand?

    That doesn't stop MS from replacing the inner workings of the recycle bin with something like shadow copies. I think it might have merit.

    I still can't figure out why previous versions doesn't work for me.

  • User profile image
    AndyC

    Massif wrote:
    That may be true today, but there's nothing stopping previous versions from storing every change / delete or move every time a file is changed.


    Then are two problems with that approach:

    1. Temporary files - by nature created/changed often. You'd poison the PV cache with files nobody needs.
    2. Presenting UI that makes frequently changing files work in an identifiable way. Likewise for inter-related files.

    1. is reasonably easy the fix as long as app vendors play by the rules (as if!), 2. is much more difficult.

    Even Apple's time machine still only works with periodic snapshots. It's much more common for someone to want to get back to "How it was before I went to lunch" than "The 13th time Word's autosave kicked in this morning"

    Not saying it can't be done but it requires a lot of UI work and probably a lot more redundant storage than we have even today.

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