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MCAD / MCSD

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  • User profile image
    GrumpyWookie

    With the upcoming releases of VS.NET 2005, and SQL-2005, has there been any indication of when the next EXAMS for MCP / MCSD / MCAD will be available ??

    I'm interested to know how many people have completed any of the Microsoft exams/certifications ?

    I've completed 2 VB-6 exams, and 2 C# exams - haven't got to MCSD yet (or MCAD).

    The company I'm working for thinks "they're not worth the paper they're printed on".

    I disagree - but understand that some people simply "learn the exam" - rather than learn the content.

    Same with Uni - learning content simply to pass exams - and finish assignments by short-cutting.

    I think I learnt MORE in my first year in a junior-programmer role, than 3 years at Uni...

    Similar with MCSD - can you learn it "on-the-job" ??  I think NOT - as there's some stuff in the study book that I'll never use (or will depend on client / project)...

    Currently reading about Serviced Components - and using .NET DLLs within COM+.

    And "Windows Services" - a bit tricky, I found !!  

  • User profile image
    GrumpyWookie

    LPI ??

    Linux-Powered-Idiot ?!?    Smiley

  • User profile image
    rasx

    I'm studying for certification and don't expect the tests to updated this year.

  • User profile image
    GrumpyWookie

    The LPI exams - are they more like MCSE (as in Sys Admin / Config) certifications ??

    Rather than "development" as such ??    Or are there C & C++ exams for Linux ??

    What's the deal with Kylix ?  I heard some hype a while ago - about developing on Linux
     
    Just wondering what sort of app's you might build - and whether there's some ADO.NET equivalent...   (or would you use ODBC ?)

    I just haven't really used Linux - I could count on one hand the number of times I've even seen Linux.

  • User profile image
    JKelley

    For cryin' out loud even a MS certification thread gets hijacked to talk about linux!!!??!!

    I've been looking at doing an MCSD but I'm holding off for a month just to see if new editions of the training materials are coming soon.  I don't want to waste my money on the current books if better ones are just around the corner.

  • User profile image
    MisterDonut

    I have to agree that the MCAD / MCSD really isn't worth the paper it's printed on. I will also say that I have both certs, being a Charter Member of the MCAD as well.

    You're far better off in my opinion to get a Computer Science degree (Bachelors or Masters) than to get certified. One exception to this rule are those people who work for companies who want to become gold partners (or whatever its called) with Microsoft. I think they require people to actually have the certs. Then, it's probably worth it for job security.

    But to have a developer certification that doesn't require you to write code (just look at code), really isn't that valuable, IMHO.

  • User profile image
    Tensor

    I knew a guy who got an exchange server cert without ever touching exchange server.

    He did a lot of travelling so just read the exam cram books on his train journeys, then passed the exam first time. Because of this and similar stories I pretty much ignore the whole certification process...

  • User profile image
    JKelley

    I just want more "bling" for my wall and I don't feel like trying to go back and get my master's degree yet.  Especially since the company I work for wouldn't pay for the master's unless it was directly applicable to our business (understandable) plus make me stay another 3 years after I'm done (not gonna happen).  Smiley (I already have my BS in CS)

  • User profile image
    Marsella

    It all depends on how you look at it. I am currently studying for 316 and using Kalanis book.  I work through all the examples on VS and have learned loads.  I already have a degree in computing and am employed as a developer using pre .NET MS technologies.  Just because some people cheat or do the bare minimum doesnt make the cert worthless. Plenty of companies would look on it favourably if accompanied by a degree and some experience.

  • User profile image
    qwert231

    I've been told over and over, Experience trumps certs. But, certs can't hurt if you've also got experience. HR and IT recruiters like to see experience, and if they see exp and certs, they will probably beleive the certs mean something. If they just see certs, they may smell something fishy.

    I'd like to try for the certs... and am working through the books now.

  • User profile image
    GrumpyWookie

    MisterDonut wrote:

    ... people who work for companies who want to become gold partners (or whatever its called) with Microsoft. I think they require people to actually have the certs...



    Yep - the way a company gets a Microsoft Partnership is by how many cert'ed people they have.

    https://partner.microsoft.com/global/40009613

    I'm looking to get a job with a Gold Certified partner - who actually pay MORE for cert'ed employees.

    Also - I've got a bachelor degree - and 11 years experience.

    But - you're right, and employer looks for a MIX of attributes - formal uni, experience AND Cert's.

    Smiley

  • User profile image
    prophecy

    Hi there,

    I'm considering certification, but am also in doubt like many of you about which books to buy.

    Previous post date from January, we are now August, and recently this news was posted:
    http://mcpmag.com/news/article.asp?EditorialsID=821

    Next to buying "old" books, I'm developing in 2.0 for a while now, and taking tests for 1.1 seems a little silly.

    Anybody happens to know if Microsoft is planning new versions of their Training Kits ?

    (Other books on 2.0 for certification preparation also welcome)

    Thanks in advance.

  • User profile image
    erik_

    Microsoft New and Upcomming titles

    I see no new MCAD/MCSD core kit standing there yet. Maby there is no core kit anymore with the new program, I dunno.

    Me just got the MCAD/MCSD pack for .NET 1.1 second handed, but planning on taking .NET 2.0 exams. But with this I am able to start today and then learn a few new bits later on.

  • User profile image
    Steve411

    A programmer doesn't need a MCAD or MCSD degree to show others how good he or she really is. It's all in the way you work.

    1.) Be trustworthy
    2.) Be ambitious
    3.) Though programming is complicated now, always throw a little humour around with you and the client.
    4.) Always suggest new ideas to make the application better. (Applies to 5).
    5.) Be innovative

    Do the above and to me you've already got and MCAD certification.Smiley
    Steve.

  • User profile image
    irascian

    chrisoc wrote:

    I'm interested to know how many people have completed any of the Microsoft exams/certifications ?



    I've got about 12 down (on the .net side I've only taken the C# Web and C# Windows exams) but no qualification as such. I think at one point I worked out that if I just took three more exams I'd be an MCSE, and MCSD and an MCDBA, but I couldn't be bothered. I didn't take the exams to earn qualifications.

    On their own I think the qualifications are close to worthless. The exams themselves test if you can "learn by rote" and that's about it. I've passed each one with a good score on first pass. To pass one you just need to swot for a week and then 4 weeks later if you took the same test again you'd probably fail.

    What the STUDY MATERIAL for the exams IS good for is getting you a broad overview of a new subject. Most of the training kits are a good way of getting into a new subject, and I take the exams as a sort of self-test to see if I've understood the broad concepts.

    When interviewing the only interest I have in candidates who have the qualifications is if they've done them in their own time and at their own expense - that indicates someone quite passionate about their work and prepared to "go the extra mile". Experience is what counts but if I had two "equal" candidates and one had MCAD/MCSD done in their own time and the other didn't I'd probably take the one with the MCAD/MCSD.

  • User profile image
    blowdart

    Well my view is as follows.

    When you can learn and pass an exam parrot fashion it's worthless.
    When a "qualification" is used to garner marketing money and gold partner status, as opposed to furthering your employee's knowledge it's worthless.
    When a "qualification" can be canceled by new exam availability it's worthless.

    Work wants us qualified for marketing reasons. I have no problem with that, as long as I don't have to do it in my own time. The exams don't offer me any benefits, so if it's important to the company to get me qualified, send me on a boot camp for a week.

    This is not the most popular opinion, but I had a lot of fun arguing it when interviewing at Avanade (ah, the joy you can have in an interview when you've already decided there's no way to want to work somewhere)

  • User profile image
    Detroit Muscle

    I'll add my 2 cents...

    Vendor certifications are worthless. If you already have and ABET accredited degree (which I consider a must for working in development) get your PE licence from the government.

    I've never met someone who had a vendor certification that I considered a competent developer, and I've never met someone who had a PE licence I didn't consider excellent. And I've worked alongside plenty of developers.

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