Coffeehouse Thread

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At the risk of sounding like a jerk and being insensitive..

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  • User profile image
    Jason I

    I was reading Steve Job's Obit today.. (No, he's not dead.. Someone prematurely posted it. A link is: here..)

    In it, Jobs is listed as being Buddhist..  If memory serves me right, Buddhists believe, from the four noble truths, that Suffering exists, and the goal of Buddhism is to end suffering (at least, on an internal basis). The root cause of suffering is (and I just got a quote) "attachment to or craving for worldly pleasures OF ALL KIND" (emphasis mine). Additionally, suffering only ends when one is released from those desires (via Nirvana). Buddhists who are reading this, please correct me where I'm wrong - I want to make sure I understand this right.

    If this is the case, one can make a very strong argument in the Apple (along with multitudes of other companies) do nothing but attempt to create desire and envy in their customers (and potential customers). The iPod alone is picture-perfect example of "worldly pleasures".

    Does this not seem contradictory? To me, a Buddhist who supports attempts to increase desire for worldly pleasures is similar to a Jew/Christian/Muslim who promotes Atheism. And as CEO, of course Jobs wants people to desire his product..Right??!

    I'm certain I'll get a few responses saying how Apple and such aren't really trying to induce desire in people (and if you honestly believe that any corporation is not trying to get people to desire their product, you're delusional...), but seriously.. What's up with that? Or maybe he's someone interested in Buddhism and ascribes to some of their values, but not the core tenants? Now --that-- I'll believe.

    Anyone think I'm unreasonable?

  • User profile image
    stevo_

    Dunno but I went on the Apple site today and noticed there was some new ads.. by new I mean anything since 2006.. here in the UK those ads failed faster than the hindenburg..

    I really wonder whats going on in America that lets these adverts stay on.. their getting unbelievably sladerous and full of lies and 'matter of fact' imposed bullshít.

    Think I might start myself a business in america and start slagging my competition off because aparently its perfectly legal there..

    And steve jobs is about as much of a buddhist as I am.. surely hes a scientologist.

  • User profile image
    jason818_25​3.33

    Check your sources. That site says the man is dead. When clearly he is not. The site also calls him Buddhist? LOL! He’s probably many things but Buddhist?

  • User profile image
    W3bbo

    jason818_253.33 said:

    Check your sources. That site says the man is dead. When clearly he is not. The site also calls him Buddhist? LOL! He’s probably many things but Buddhist?

    Many newspapers write obituaries years in advance (since in the best-case you have 24 hour notice between death and the newspaper being printed, which isn't enough time to investigate, interview, and write an article, so they do it in advance). In this case it was prompted by his recent health scares (the first: Pancreatic cancer, the second: unrelated post-surgery complications). The error was that they accidentally ran the 17-page article when they didn't mean to, a simple mistake. It happens a lot.

  • User profile image
    brian.​shapiro

    jason818_253.33 said:

    Check your sources. That site says the man is dead. When clearly he is not. The site also calls him Buddhist? LOL! He’s probably many things but Buddhist?

    They meant to say he's a living Buddha.

  • User profile image
    Dodo

    brian.shapiro said:
    jason818_253.33 said:
    *snip*
    They meant to say he's a living Buddha.
    Well, he kind of is, buddhism is about neglegting the own desires, noone said anything about creating them. Strangely that would mean they have to take revenue for their products but make no use out of it personally. Which then again would mean Apple is a rich company and all employees have to linger in the dirty slums, downtown nowhere until they are finally released from their very desire to do anything and die... oh wait... have I missed something?

  • User profile image
    jason818_25​3.33

    W3bbo said:
    jason818_253.33 said:
    *snip*
    Many newspapers write obituaries years in advance (since in the best-case you have 24 hour notice between death and the newspaper being printed, which isn't enough time to investigate, interview, and write an article, so they do it in advance). In this case it was prompted by his recent health scares (the first: Pancreatic cancer, the second: unrelated post-surgery complications). The error was that they accidentally ran the 17-page article when they didn't mean to, a simple mistake. It happens a lot.
    Darn, looks like i have been left off the list again. Smiley

  • User profile image
    Jason I

    Dodo said:
    brian.shapiro said:
    *snip*
    Well, he kind of is, buddhism is about neglegting the own desires, noone said anything about creating them. Strangely that would mean they have to take revenue for their products but make no use out of it personally. Which then again would mean Apple is a rich company and all employees have to linger in the dirty slums, downtown nowhere until they are finally released from their very desire to do anything and die... oh wait... have I missed something?
    Interesting.

    I haven't heard anyone say that Steve is selfless because of his $1.00 a year salary and thus has no desires.. Which is probably good, because I would have had to retort with his 90 million dollar jet he was given as a gift instead..

  • User profile image
    Bass

    Jason I said:
    Dodo said:
    *snip*
    Interesting.

    I haven't heard anyone say that Steve is selfless because of his $1.00 a year salary and thus has no desires.. Which is probably good, because I would have had to retort with his 90 million dollar jet he was given as a gift instead..
    I think I read he lives in a house with no furniture that is close to be condemned as unsafe. The man is far far far out there, you pretty much have to be to run Apple successfully.

  • User profile image
    JChung2006

    Steve Jobs is not Apple.  Don't confuse him with his company.

  • User profile image
    W3bbo

    Jason I said:
    Dodo said:
    *snip*
    Interesting.

    I haven't heard anyone say that Steve is selfless because of his $1.00 a year salary and thus has no desires.. Which is probably good, because I would have had to retort with his 90 million dollar jet he was given as a gift instead..
    His $1 salary is because he gets paid in stock options... and for tax reasons. Lots of other CEOs do it.

  • User profile image
    Bass

    W3bbo said:
    Jason I said:
    *snip*
    His $1 salary is because he gets paid in stock options... and for tax reasons. Lots of other CEOs do it.
    Steve Jobs is among the richest people in the world. Other then the jet (even Warren "3 bedroom house" Buffet has one), I don't think he really flaunts his wealth.

  • User profile image
    Jason I

    Bass said:
    W3bbo said:
    *snip*
    Steve Jobs is among the richest people in the world. Other then the jet (even Warren "3 bedroom house" Buffet has one), I don't think he really flaunts his wealth.
    I would agree with all of that. Steve Jobs sdoesn't flaunt wealth like, say, Donald Trump.

    My point was that he attests to be of a certain faith, while running a company (and supposedly inspiring) that creates devices (iPod, Macs, etc..) that promotes feelings which is anti-thetical to his faith (envy and desire).

    It doesn't make sense to me.

    Regardless, I"m glad he's ok.. No one deserves a death by cancer.

  • User profile image
    Ray7

    JChung2006 said:
    Steve Jobs is not Apple.  Don't confuse him with his company.
    Steve Jobs is very much Apple; to such an extent that people are concerned at how well the company will do without him. That's why there was such a fuss over how gaunt he looked at the WWDC.

  • User profile image
    Ray7

    Alive, well and still obnoxious ....


  • User profile image
    Jason I

    Ray7 said:
    Alive, well and still obnoxious ....


    In all fairness, Steve Jobs was diagnosed with Pancreatic cancer.. I have read that only 5% of those diagnosed with it are alive five years later.

    He might well need a Handcapped spot.

  • User profile image
    Wil

    Steve Jobs is apparently still alive, unless he applied some bizarre Pixar holography to his Buddhist beliefs so that he would be reincarnated as a virtual image of himself.

    Really, I had no idea that he was a Buddhist.  Does his Ipod just go, "OMMMMMM...."?

  • User profile image
    W3bbo

    Jason I said:
    Ray7 said:
    *snip*
    In all fairness, Steve Jobs was diagnosed with Pancreatic cancer.. I have read that only 5% of those diagnosed with it are alive five years later.

    He might well need a Handcapped spot.

    Jason I: There are two main types of pancreatic cancer: the one that kills pretty much everyone who gets it, and the other (rarer) one that is pretty well survivable.

    He had the second type and was totally clean by 2007.

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