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  • User profile image
    intelman

    Bas said:
    intelman said:
    *snip*


    Office 2007 Home & Student Edition also costs $79, and also contains a word processor, presentation software and a spreadsheet. On top of that, it adds OneNote and a 3 pc license. So how is iWork the better deal?

    I do see your point there. Both suites provide the same types of apps and Office is the better deal.

    The problem is if I get Office for Windows, I have to get a suite that includes Access and Publisher.

    If I get an Office suite for Mac, I do not need those ( I do need what iWork provides) and school provides some program that will take place of Access (we do not use it intensely, some of our instruments output to an access file, which then gets translated into tabulated data.

    It is nice to know Microsoft has a suite licensed for three computers at 79 dollars. At first I saw this.

    I later found the 79 dollar suite you spoke of.

    Now if only Windows (Ultimate) had such a deal. I do not *need* ultimate, but I really want/need the shadowcopy undelete feature.

    Microsoft really needs one tier, so everyone can enjoy the benefits of these "Ultimate tiers".

    There has been so many times I change a formula and want to go back to a spreadsheet with the previous formula. I love that feature, it is just a shame it is in the Ultimate version of Vista.

     
     
     
     

    I do see your point there. Both suites provide the same types of apps and Office is the better deal.

    The problem is if I get Office for Windows, I have to get a suite that includes Access and Publisher.

    If I get an Office suite for Mac, I do not need those ( I do need what iWork provides) and school provides some program that will take place of Access (we do not use it intensely, some of our instruments output to an access file, which then gets translated into tabulated data.

    It is nice to know Microsoft has a suite licensed for three computers at 79 dollars. At first I saw this.

    I later found the 79 dollar suite you spoke of.

    Now if only Windows (Ultimate) had such a deal. I do not *need* ultimate, but I really want/need the shadowcopy undelete feature.

    Microsoft really needs one tier, so everyone can enjoy the benefits of these "Ultimate tiers".

    There has been so many times I change a formula and want to go back to a spreadsheet with the previous formula. I love that feature, it is just a shame it is in the Ultimate version of Vista.

  • User profile image
    elmer

    jamie said:
    littleguru said:
    *snip*
    i think the retail / OEM "barrier ... needs to be re-thought.

    ie - Windows at Staples = 499$
    but everyone knows its really $299
    ..or even way less for premium

    This is done to make OEMs not lose sales to upgraders / build your own crowd.

    I think windows sold more - when it was on shelves for 99$  that you could pick up.Ive read that windows is really around 60$ for one machine.  so... sell THAT! everywhere!

    i  think the retail / OEM "barrier ... needs to be re-thought.

    ie - Windows at Staples = 499$
    but everyone knows its really $299

    The thing with OEM vs. Retail, as far as the pricing is concerned, is essentially to do with 3 points.

    1.        Support.
    OEM versions of MS software are supported by the OEM, instead of MS... and the reduced price to the OEM is supposed to reflect that support cost to the OEM.  Note: I realise that OEM's usually try to wriggle out of the support requirement and tell their customers to call MS, but that's what the license requirements state.

    2.        Re-Use.
    OEM Licenses are normally tied to the machine they were installed on, and cannot be transferred, whereas Retail licenses are normally transferable from machine to machine, so long as you remove the product each time. i.e. OEM Office is tied to the machine it was pre-installed on, so you are up for a new copy if you buy a new machine, whereas your retail office can be installed on the new machine, sol long as you remove it from the old machine first.

    3.        Upgrade Options.
    OEM Licenses are normally limited in their ability to upgrade, and generally require a new version rather than an upgrade.

     

  • User profile image
    rjdohnert

    Impeach Ballmer.

  • User profile image
    jamie

    rjdohnert said:
    Impeach Ballmer.

    have you been by miniMSFT recently? 
    last 2 posts have over 800 softie replies - and ive never seen so much "Ballmer must go now" sentiment

    in other news:   http://news.cnet.com/8301-13506_3-10148886-17.html?tag=newsFeaturedBlogArea.0

    or.. bla bla bla! Smiley

    in more other news im liking bioshock.  Ive been to the office of ryan - ive finsihed and moved the bomb, ive restarted the core!




    edit:  Consolidation of all my above suggestions - and everything ive ever gone on about Tongue Out

    A Simple Plan.
    Un-doing the damage of the Ballmer Administration

    Windows
    • Put back the 6 things I listed above ( this = NO noticeable change - just option for changing back.)
    • Put back true theming - and make even more robust
    • Create an OPTIONAL UI layer - that shows off WPF and puts Linux cube thing to shame (look to MMCenter for start - add programs and 3d-ize it)
    • Add icons back into startmenu list  * if you thought the old 3d colourful ones were ..too much - at least put a graphical simple icon beside each (like the new flat simple taskbar icons ... black and white)

    Office
    • Provide old toolbar option for longtime users/customers
    • Offer new Office Environments - like Dusty Desk (with typewriter *WPF) or Shuttle Writer (space theme *WPF)
      *these are just eye candy or .. fun ( = ENOUGH with all enterprise only enhancements to office)

    Expression Suite
    Main Issue: Failing to get Macromedia before Adobe
       Solution:  Buy certain assets of Corel Corp. including Fractal Paint, Photopaint, CorelDraw and KAIs

    • Best case result: 
    1. Expression is finally viewed as a true adobe competitor (not just a "use this to make MS stuff" suite of apps). Expression Draw, Expression Paint, Expression Photo.
    2. Rescue the thousands of Corel designers/users from uncertain future
    3. Mobilize this new dev/designer force with new tools - including tight integration between coreldraw vector design and Expression Blend? * Corel used to offer a flash like program called Rave - that was really good but made HUGE swf files. Use this as the starting code for how Silverlight integration should "work" but fix the file size issues. (had working animation timeline within coreldraw and everything - res-erect pls!
    4. Fill up the Office live clipart gallery with the 100's of thousands of royalty free clipart from corel purchase
    5. Release all Corel true type fonts in a new web font pack, bundle with office and windows.  This means overnight there could be the possibility of a web with more than 20 actual fonts. (picture the web if 7 and O14 came with 200 new installed fonts.  IE8 - would also install at least 100 NEW fonts. (*devalues adobe font portfolio / make avail to all browsers - "altruism" whatever  ..just fix fonts on the web. i think people will really like more variety=good will)
    *no need for weft - if you own the fonts and set them ... free (  yes...free... )

    Expression Web:
    This program is basically FrontPage - with a lot more CSS reading panes and better code output.  But 2 issues hamper its uptake:
    1. the removal of drawing tables - and 2. the removal of inline preview.
    Solution 1.:  Add back new Drawing tool for not only tables but layers, css and spans - in one simple toolbox
    Solution 2.: Add back Inline preview - but offer "Choose rendering engine" option - which - if browser installed - would let you inline preview IE, FF, Chrome, Safari  (geko, webkit, trident....)

    Internet Explorer
    • Add ability to customize and break apart every part of IE. (coolbars on steroids) Let people choose rendering engine.  Perhaps use Webkit - or whatever choice would make the MOST web devs happy. (i had thought geko - but don't care if its webkit.. just want to get back closer to the days when you only had to check IE - and nothing else mattered.)
    • Find solution to the rectangle/ boxy look.  

    MSN /Live / search / maps / telescope .....
    • All web properties rebranded Windows.com (as sections) - one site to rule them all bla bla
    • Hire speculate swamp to run search division (so crazy - it just might work!) Wink

    Xbox/Zune/winMO
    • Merge zune and win mobile with Xbox - create  XTalkx ( or xphone / Xbox Mobile)
    • If you must have a music player - call it Windows Media Player component and license out

    Server/enterprise
    • No change - but id worry about pricing

    Corp
    • create position for Chief Creative Officer ... somehow ...fill it.


    ***DISCLAIMER - yes this is the same old stuff - but i actually believe ALL of it needs to happen. If it did - im not sure there would be much left to complain about. (although im sure i could find something) Wink

    lastly - to the wonderful forum critics here on 9 - please ask yourself - what would YOU do? At least I have a list of things to put back / fix.  What are your ideas?



    ppps - from the What's in a Name Dept:  looks like Popfly is history
    http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleBasic&articleId=9126718&intsrc=news_ts_head

    youre out!

  • User profile image
    SlackmasterK

    jamie said:
    rjdohnert said:
    *snip*

    have you been by miniMSFT recently? 
    last 2 posts have over 800 softie replies - and ive never seen so much "Ballmer must go now" sentiment

    in other news:   http://news.cnet.com/8301-13506_3-10148886-17.html?tag=newsFeaturedBlogArea.0

    or.. bla bla bla! Smiley

    in more other news im liking bioshock.  Ive been to the office of ryan - ive finsihed and moved the bomb, ive restarted the core!




    edit:  Consolidation of all my above suggestions - and everything ive ever gone on about Tongue Out

    A Simple Plan.
    Un-doing the damage of the Ballmer Administration

    Windows
    • Put back the 6 things I listed above ( this = NO noticeable change - just option for changing back.)
    • Put back true theming - and make even more robust
    • Create an OPTIONAL UI layer - that shows off WPF and puts Linux cube thing to shame (look to MMCenter for start - add programs and 3d-ize it)
    • Add icons back into startmenu list  * if you thought the old 3d colourful ones were ..too much - at least put a graphical simple icon beside each (like the new flat simple taskbar icons ... black and white)

    Office
    • Provide old toolbar option for longtime users/customers
    • Offer new Office Environments - like Dusty Desk (with typewriter *WPF) or Shuttle Writer (space theme *WPF)
      *these are just eye candy or .. fun ( = ENOUGH with all enterprise only enhancements to office)

    Expression Suite
    Main Issue: Failing to get Macromedia before Adobe
       Solution:  Buy certain assets of Corel Corp. including Fractal Paint, Photopaint, CorelDraw and KAIs

    • Best case result: 
    1. Expression is finally viewed as a true adobe competitor (not just a "use this to make MS stuff" suite of apps). Expression Draw, Expression Paint, Expression Photo.
    2. Rescue the thousands of Corel designers/users from uncertain future
    3. Mobilize this new dev/designer force with new tools - including tight integration between coreldraw vector design and Expression Blend? * Corel used to offer a flash like program called Rave - that was really good but made HUGE swf files. Use this as the starting code for how Silverlight integration should "work" but fix the file size issues. (had working animation timeline within coreldraw and everything - res-erect pls!
    4. Fill up the Office live clipart gallery with the 100's of thousands of royalty free clipart from corel purchase
    5. Release all Corel true type fonts in a new web font pack, bundle with office and windows.  This means overnight there could be the possibility of a web with more than 20 actual fonts. (picture the web if 7 and O14 came with 200 new installed fonts.  IE8 - would also install at least 100 NEW fonts. (*devalues adobe font portfolio / make avail to all browsers - "altruism" whatever  ..just fix fonts on the web. i think people will really like more variety=good will)
    *no need for weft - if you own the fonts and set them ... free (  yes...free... )

    Expression Web:
    This program is basically FrontPage - with a lot more CSS reading panes and better code output.  But 2 issues hamper its uptake:
    1. the removal of drawing tables - and 2. the removal of inline preview.
    Solution 1.:  Add back new Drawing tool for not only tables but layers, css and spans - in one simple toolbox
    Solution 2.: Add back Inline preview - but offer "Choose rendering engine" option - which - if browser installed - would let you inline preview IE, FF, Chrome, Safari  (geko, webkit, trident....)

    Internet Explorer
    • Add ability to customize and break apart every part of IE. (coolbars on steroids) Let people choose rendering engine.  Perhaps use Webkit - or whatever choice would make the MOST web devs happy. (i had thought geko - but don't care if its webkit.. just want to get back closer to the days when you only had to check IE - and nothing else mattered.)
    • Find solution to the rectangle/ boxy look.  

    MSN /Live / search / maps / telescope .....
    • All web properties rebranded Windows.com (as sections) - one site to rule them all bla bla
    • Hire speculate swamp to run search division (so crazy - it just might work!) Wink

    Xbox/Zune/winMO
    • Merge zune and win mobile with Xbox - create  XTalkx ( or xphone / Xbox Mobile)
    • If you must have a music player - call it Windows Media Player component and license out

    Server/enterprise
    • No change - but id worry about pricing

    Corp
    • create position for Chief Creative Officer ... somehow ...fill it.


    ***DISCLAIMER - yes this is the same old stuff - but i actually believe ALL of it needs to happen. If it did - im not sure there would be much left to complain about. (although im sure i could find something) Wink

    lastly - to the wonderful forum critics here on 9 - please ask yourself - what would YOU do? At least I have a list of things to put back / fix.  What are your ideas?



    ppps - from the What's in a Name Dept:  looks like Popfly is history
    http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleBasic&articleId=9126718&intsrc=news_ts_head

    youre out!
    Your rants are starting to resemble those of SpectateSwamp.  Has anyone mentioned this yet?   

  • User profile image
    jamie

    SlackmasterK said:
    jamie said:
    *snip*
    Your rants are starting to resemble those of SpectateSwamp.  Has anyone mentioned this yet?   

  • User profile image
    blowdart

    jamie said:
    rjdohnert said:
    *snip*

    have you been by miniMSFT recently? 
    last 2 posts have over 800 softie replies - and ive never seen so much "Ballmer must go now" sentiment

    in other news:   http://news.cnet.com/8301-13506_3-10148886-17.html?tag=newsFeaturedBlogArea.0

    or.. bla bla bla! Smiley

    in more other news im liking bioshock.  Ive been to the office of ryan - ive finsihed and moved the bomb, ive restarted the core!




    edit:  Consolidation of all my above suggestions - and everything ive ever gone on about Tongue Out

    A Simple Plan.
    Un-doing the damage of the Ballmer Administration

    Windows
    • Put back the 6 things I listed above ( this = NO noticeable change - just option for changing back.)
    • Put back true theming - and make even more robust
    • Create an OPTIONAL UI layer - that shows off WPF and puts Linux cube thing to shame (look to MMCenter for start - add programs and 3d-ize it)
    • Add icons back into startmenu list  * if you thought the old 3d colourful ones were ..too much - at least put a graphical simple icon beside each (like the new flat simple taskbar icons ... black and white)

    Office
    • Provide old toolbar option for longtime users/customers
    • Offer new Office Environments - like Dusty Desk (with typewriter *WPF) or Shuttle Writer (space theme *WPF)
      *these are just eye candy or .. fun ( = ENOUGH with all enterprise only enhancements to office)

    Expression Suite
    Main Issue: Failing to get Macromedia before Adobe
       Solution:  Buy certain assets of Corel Corp. including Fractal Paint, Photopaint, CorelDraw and KAIs

    • Best case result: 
    1. Expression is finally viewed as a true adobe competitor (not just a "use this to make MS stuff" suite of apps). Expression Draw, Expression Paint, Expression Photo.
    2. Rescue the thousands of Corel designers/users from uncertain future
    3. Mobilize this new dev/designer force with new tools - including tight integration between coreldraw vector design and Expression Blend? * Corel used to offer a flash like program called Rave - that was really good but made HUGE swf files. Use this as the starting code for how Silverlight integration should "work" but fix the file size issues. (had working animation timeline within coreldraw and everything - res-erect pls!
    4. Fill up the Office live clipart gallery with the 100's of thousands of royalty free clipart from corel purchase
    5. Release all Corel true type fonts in a new web font pack, bundle with office and windows.  This means overnight there could be the possibility of a web with more than 20 actual fonts. (picture the web if 7 and O14 came with 200 new installed fonts.  IE8 - would also install at least 100 NEW fonts. (*devalues adobe font portfolio / make avail to all browsers - "altruism" whatever  ..just fix fonts on the web. i think people will really like more variety=good will)
    *no need for weft - if you own the fonts and set them ... free (  yes...free... )

    Expression Web:
    This program is basically FrontPage - with a lot more CSS reading panes and better code output.  But 2 issues hamper its uptake:
    1. the removal of drawing tables - and 2. the removal of inline preview.
    Solution 1.:  Add back new Drawing tool for not only tables but layers, css and spans - in one simple toolbox
    Solution 2.: Add back Inline preview - but offer "Choose rendering engine" option - which - if browser installed - would let you inline preview IE, FF, Chrome, Safari  (geko, webkit, trident....)

    Internet Explorer
    • Add ability to customize and break apart every part of IE. (coolbars on steroids) Let people choose rendering engine.  Perhaps use Webkit - or whatever choice would make the MOST web devs happy. (i had thought geko - but don't care if its webkit.. just want to get back closer to the days when you only had to check IE - and nothing else mattered.)
    • Find solution to the rectangle/ boxy look.  

    MSN /Live / search / maps / telescope .....
    • All web properties rebranded Windows.com (as sections) - one site to rule them all bla bla
    • Hire speculate swamp to run search division (so crazy - it just might work!) Wink

    Xbox/Zune/winMO
    • Merge zune and win mobile with Xbox - create  XTalkx ( or xphone / Xbox Mobile)
    • If you must have a music player - call it Windows Media Player component and license out

    Server/enterprise
    • No change - but id worry about pricing

    Corp
    • create position for Chief Creative Officer ... somehow ...fill it.


    ***DISCLAIMER - yes this is the same old stuff - but i actually believe ALL of it needs to happen. If it did - im not sure there would be much left to complain about. (although im sure i could find something) Wink

    lastly - to the wonderful forum critics here on 9 - please ask yourself - what would YOU do? At least I have a list of things to put back / fix.  What are your ideas?



    ppps - from the What's in a Name Dept:  looks like Popfly is history
    http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleBasic&articleId=9126718&intsrc=news_ts_head

    youre out!
    Expression Web:
     2. the removal of inline preview.

    What removal? (I can't believe I'm actually responding to this - I still feel using layoffs to promote your own ego is disgusting)




    What do you mean by inline?

  • User profile image
    jamie

    blowdart said:
    jamie said:
    *snip*
    Expression Web:
     2. the removal of inline preview.

    What removal? (I can't believe I'm actually responding to this - I still feel using layoffs to promote your own ego is disgusting)




    What do you mean by inline?
    then stop being disgusting


     run along now...

    uech whey an bury ye heid now...

    * inline browser preview - not design mode


    *OR ONE CLICK INLINE IE  no stupid other windows like a mac or dreamweaver (that ms is trying to copy)

  • User profile image
    Ray7

    jamie said:
    blowdart said:
    *snip*
    then stop being disgusting


     run along now...

    uech whey an bury ye heid now...

    * inline browser preview - not design mode


    *OR ONE CLICK INLINE IE  no stupid other windows like a mac or dreamweaver (that ms is trying to copy)
    Could you at least write in whole sentences?

  • User profile image
    Ray7

    rjdohnert said:
    Impeach Ballmer.
    I think it's too late.

  • User profile image
    Cream​Filling512

    Ray7 said:
    jamie said:
    *snip*
    Could you at least write in whole sentences?

    Seconded, trying to parse jamie's posts just makes my brain explode.  I'm sorry but half are a huge mess of letters.

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