Coffeehouse Thread

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Kin avaiable

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  • User profile image
    Dovella
  • User profile image
    kitron
  • User profile image
    Ray7
  • User profile image
    kitron

    Ray7 said:
    kitron said:
    *snip*

    Yes, the biggest problem is the pricing by the looks of it.

    Yep the pricing sucks big time. 

    30$ for data, 40$ voice.

    If you add zune pass to the deal you have to pay 85$ /month.

     

    WOW

     

  • User profile image
    Ray7

    kitron said:
    Ray7 said:
    *snip*

    Yep the pricing sucks big time. 

    30$ for data, 40$ voice.

    If you add zune pass to the deal you have to pay 85$ /month.

     

    WOW

     

    But it's not a total disaster.

     

    The Studio software looks like a huge win.

  • User profile image
    kitron

    Ray7 said:
    kitron said:
    *snip*

    But it's not a total disaster.

     

    The Studio software looks like a huge win.

    Yep maybe they can hook that into WP7 at some point.

  • User profile image
    giovanni

    Ray7 said:
    kitron said:
    *snip*

    Yes, the biggest problem is the pricing by the looks of it.

    I am not understanding the engadget pricing argument: besides the annoying mail in rebate, the KINs cost $50 and $100 respectively. The engadget  review keeps mixing monthly fees for voice and data with the onetime fee for the hardware. Based on the review, the monthly charges would be about $70. I have no way of doing an exact comparison because of exchange rates and differences in services, but here in France you can buy the basic iPhone (one without WiFi) for €49 and the more advanced ones (more memory and WiFi) for €179. To this you have to add a minimum data and voice subscription of €61 per month for a two year contract for 3h of voice and 3h of data per month. To me it looks that the KINs are expensive, but their price schemas are not SHOCKING.

     

    A more fair analysis would have compared hardware prices on one hand and equivalent voice and data plan for at least the duration of a contract.

     

    I am not arguing that the KINs are inexpensive; I am saying that the analysis by engadget is bogus.

  • User profile image
    giovanni

    giovanni said:
    Ray7 said:
    *snip*

    I am not understanding the engadget pricing argument: besides the annoying mail in rebate, the KINs cost $50 and $100 respectively. The engadget  review keeps mixing monthly fees for voice and data with the onetime fee for the hardware. Based on the review, the monthly charges would be about $70. I have no way of doing an exact comparison because of exchange rates and differences in services, but here in France you can buy the basic iPhone (one without WiFi) for €49 and the more advanced ones (more memory and WiFi) for €179. To this you have to add a minimum data and voice subscription of €61 per month for a two year contract for 3h of voice and 3h of data per month. To me it looks that the KINs are expensive, but their price schemas are not SHOCKING.

     

    A more fair analysis would have compared hardware prices on one hand and equivalent voice and data plan for at least the duration of a contract.

     

    I am not arguing that the KINs are inexpensive; I am saying that the analysis by engadget is bogus.

    OK, I made a littel comparison with some data I found on the ATT website (using my old Boston zip code).

     

    The basic iPhone with 8GB and no WiFi costs $99. The data plans cost $30 per month and the cheapest voice plan (450 national minutes) costs $39.99. How is that any cheaper than what will be offered by Verizon?

  • User profile image
    turrican

    Ok, I won't liked for what I'll say now... but could you atleast use the tools at your hand ( THE INTERNET ) to fix up your spellings from time to time? Atleast recheck what you post, I mean wtf "Kin avaiable"?

     

    Sometimes, you feel like a broken news bot.

     

    Sorry for being harsh.

  • User profile image
    Dovella

    turrican said:

    Ok, I won't liked for what I'll say now... but could you atleast use the tools at your hand ( THE INTERNET ) to fix up your spellings from time to time? Atleast recheck what you post, I mean wtf "Kin avaiable"?

     

    Sometimes, you feel like a broken news bot.

     

    Sorry for being harsh.

    what is the price without Verizon contract?

  • User profile image
    figuerres

    Dovella said:
    turrican said:
    *snip*

    what is the price without Verizon contract?

    here in the us almost no one buys a phone outright....

    we generally get an offer from the phone company to get a phone at a discounted price with a contract renewal.

     

    note that I do not really like the way they play that game but that's how it works.

     

    most phones here are locked to work on one phone network, the one that sold it to you.... and we have different cell systems so even if not locked some phones only work on some networks.... it's kinda nuts.

  • User profile image
    Maximus​Paynicus

    I'll wait for the PhoneDog review and some hands on with the product before I make my final decision, but it seems that every concern I had about the system was justified. 

  • User profile image
    Bass

    giovanni said:
    giovanni said:
    *snip*

    OK, I made a littel comparison with some data I found on the ATT website (using my old Boston zip code).

     

    The basic iPhone with 8GB and no WiFi costs $99. The data plans cost $30 per month and the cheapest voice plan (450 national minutes) costs $39.99. How is that any cheaper than what will be offered by Verizon?

    I don't know if you understand how the phone system in the USA works. When you buy phones from carriers at the prices they advertise, you commit yourself to a 2 year contract at a certain rate per month. Dumbphones tend to be free or close to free but require a 2 year voice plan. Smartphones these days are free to about $200 and require both a voice and a smartphone data plan.

     

    The Kin requires the same smartphone data plan that the Blackberry, Pre, Droid, etc. require. This costs $720 over two years. So the real cost of a Kin over a dumbphone is at least $720 more expensive.

     

    Well what if you want to get a data plan on a dumbphone? The monthly fee for unlimited data varies by phone. On a smartphone it is higher (iPhone, Droid, Pre, etc. are all $30/mo). However dumbphone dataplans cost anywhere between $10-20/mo. People are not happy that the Kin requires the most expensive data plan.

     

    Plus you can get a Palm Pre Plus for a total of $0.01 these days (+$720 2 yr dp). So you have a case where a dumbphone actually is costing more then a smartphone overall.

  • User profile image
    W3bbo

    Bass said:
    giovanni said:
    *snip*

    I don't know if you understand how the phone system in the USA works. When you buy phones from carriers at the prices they advertise, you commit yourself to a 2 year contract at a certain rate per month. Dumbphones tend to be free or close to free but require a 2 year voice plan. Smartphones these days are free to about $200 and require both a voice and a smartphone data plan.

     

    The Kin requires the same smartphone data plan that the Blackberry, Pre, Droid, etc. require. This costs $720 over two years. So the real cost of a Kin over a dumbphone is at least $720 more expensive.

     

    Well what if you want to get a data plan on a dumbphone? The monthly fee for unlimited data varies by phone. On a smartphone it is higher (iPhone, Droid, Pre, etc. are all $30/mo). However dumbphone dataplans cost anywhere between $10-20/mo. People are not happy that the Kin requires the most expensive data plan.

     

    Plus you can get a Palm Pre Plus for a total of $0.01 these days (+$720 2 yr dp). So you have a case where a dumbphone actually is costing more then a smartphone overall.

    I don't get "phone companies": they don't want to be relegated to simple dumb-pipes for any phone, but if I were a phone provider that's exactly what I'd want to do. Looking at mobile companies today they aren't specialising: Orange does home DSL connections and runs its own portal.

     

    Portal websites were a fad of the early-00s where pretty much any and every internet company had one, but the fact no-one really uses them and I see them as a liability.

     

    I imagine there are healthy profits to be had on handset sales, and that's fine, but anything else just doesn't seem right for a phone company to be getting into.

  • User profile image
    Cream​Filling512

    Bass said:
    giovanni said:
    *snip*

    I don't know if you understand how the phone system in the USA works. When you buy phones from carriers at the prices they advertise, you commit yourself to a 2 year contract at a certain rate per month. Dumbphones tend to be free or close to free but require a 2 year voice plan. Smartphones these days are free to about $200 and require both a voice and a smartphone data plan.

     

    The Kin requires the same smartphone data plan that the Blackberry, Pre, Droid, etc. require. This costs $720 over two years. So the real cost of a Kin over a dumbphone is at least $720 more expensive.

     

    Well what if you want to get a data plan on a dumbphone? The monthly fee for unlimited data varies by phone. On a smartphone it is higher (iPhone, Droid, Pre, etc. are all $30/mo). However dumbphone dataplans cost anywhere between $10-20/mo. People are not happy that the Kin requires the most expensive data plan.

     

    Plus you can get a Palm Pre Plus for a total of $0.01 these days (+$720 2 yr dp). So you have a case where a dumbphone actually is costing more then a smartphone overall.

    Honestly, T-Mobile plans are the only ones that make any sense  to me.  You can opt-out of a contract and out of what's essentially "financing your phone" and pay less per month for it.  Plus you get more stuff included.

  • User profile image
    Dovella

    figuerres said:
    Dovella said:
    *snip*

    here in the us almost no one buys a phone outright....

    we generally get an offer from the phone company to get a phone at a discounted price with a contract renewal.

     

    note that I do not really like the way they play that game but that's how it works.

     

    most phones here are locked to work on one phone network, the one that sold it to you.... and we have different cell systems so even if not locked some phones only work on some networks.... it's kinda nuts.

    Thanks for info.

  • User profile image
    giovanni

    figuerres said:
    Dovella said:
    *snip*

    here in the us almost no one buys a phone outright....

    we generally get an offer from the phone company to get a phone at a discounted price with a contract renewal.

     

    note that I do not really like the way they play that game but that's how it works.

     

    most phones here are locked to work on one phone network, the one that sold it to you.... and we have different cell systems so even if not locked some phones only work on some networks.... it's kinda nuts.

    Yes, and that is more or less the way it works in Europe too, with the advantage that after a certain amount of time, the company must unlock your phone if youdemand to and because here there is only one network standard, then you are finally free from the original carrier (excepted for the silly phone braning at startup and so on).

     

    P.S. I hate this model with all of my heart.

  • User profile image
    giovanni

    Bass said:
    giovanni said:
    *snip*

    I don't know if you understand how the phone system in the USA works. When you buy phones from carriers at the prices they advertise, you commit yourself to a 2 year contract at a certain rate per month. Dumbphones tend to be free or close to free but require a 2 year voice plan. Smartphones these days are free to about $200 and require both a voice and a smartphone data plan.

     

    The Kin requires the same smartphone data plan that the Blackberry, Pre, Droid, etc. require. This costs $720 over two years. So the real cost of a Kin over a dumbphone is at least $720 more expensive.

     

    Well what if you want to get a data plan on a dumbphone? The monthly fee for unlimited data varies by phone. On a smartphone it is higher (iPhone, Droid, Pre, etc. are all $30/mo). However dumbphone dataplans cost anywhere between $10-20/mo. People are not happy that the Kin requires the most expensive data plan.

     

    Plus you can get a Palm Pre Plus for a total of $0.01 these days (+$720 2 yr dp). So you have a case where a dumbphone actually is costing more then a smartphone overall.

    I agree with you that the Kin is more limited than other smart phones, but, from what I understand, it is designed to make estensive use of the internet, therefore I think it makes sense that it needs to pay as much as other phones that use the data network as much. At least, I am not surprised by the concept.

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