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Microsoft evilness rating... up 1

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  • User profile image
    W3bbo

    From SlashDot:

    Windows XP Starter Edition Snubs P4, Athlon
    Apu writes "CNET is reporting that Microsoft's Windows XP Starter Edition operating system specifically checks the result of the CPUID instruction on bootup and fails to continue if a Pentium 4 or Athlon processor is detected."

    Today, many "budget" PCs are being sold as P4 or Athlon.

    Did Microsoft ever consider second-hand PC owners buying a pre-used Athlon or P4 (which can be had even cheaper than a new Celeron) and suppose the original owner wanted to keep their XP Home/Pro license.

    That kinda shafts the owner of that PC if they wanted to stay legit.

  • User profile image
    Jaz

    not really since i think starter is OEM only.

  • User profile image
    figuerres

    W3bbo wrote:
    From SlashDot:

    Windows XP Starter Edition Snubs P4, Athlon
    Apu writes "CNET is reporting that Microsoft's Windows XP Starter Edition operating system specifically checks the result of the CPUID instruction on bootup and fails to continue if a Pentium 4 or Athlon processor is detected."

    Today, many "budget" PCs are being sold as P4 or Athlon.

    Did Microsoft ever consider second-hand PC owners buying a pre-used Athlon or P4 (which can be had even cheaper than a new Celeron) and suppose the original owner wanted to keep their XP Home/Pro license.

    That kinda shafts the owner of that PC if they wanted to stay legit.


    if this is true then someone at MSFT should be fired.

    I hope this is some kind of royal screw up or a hoax.

  • User profile image
    Manip

    As I've said before, Starter Edition is a fundamental shift in the way an Operating System is supposed to work.

    An operating system is supposed to provide the most efficient access to the hardware possible. That is a fundamental of any operating system however well or badly they do so. But in starter edition they *intentionally limit the ability of the hardware below what it is capable of.

    Jaz: But the Celeron and P4 work in the same socket, so why can't people upgrade?

    Note: Microsoft are always being evil. Look at C9 for example, it was supposed to be a transparent Microsoft, but now we know that is an illusion and it is about PR (see Scoble's posts).

  • User profile image
    Jaz

    i doubt anyone would really wish to upgrade and still use started edition, this is a non issue

  • User profile image
    Manip

    Does anyone else feel stuck?

    I mean Longhorn is going to lock users down and out of their own hardware (removing freedoms we have now), you have Mac OS X which runs no software and only on apple hardware and you have Linux with its ugly GUI (which is just an enhanced terminal at the end of the day).

    Where is a user surposed to go?

  • User profile image
    W3bbo

    Jaz wrote:
    i doubt anyone would really wish to upgrade and still use started edition, this is a non issue


    It's not that it's a "non-issue" which in reality, it really is (a non-issue)

    But it's the principle. This is akin to Ford making a budget car that won't park in an expensive supermarket's parking lot, or a cheap TV not being able to tune into expensive cable boxes.

  • User profile image
    Jaz

    W3bbo wrote:
    But it's the principle. This is akin to Ford making a budget car that won't park in an expensive supermarket's parking lot, or a cheap TV not being able to tune into expensive cable boxes.
    no, it really isn't.  Starter Edition is let's face it (I need to watch my language) and a stupid idea.  MS will argue till they're blue in the face and i can see where they're coming from but it's justa  quick buck idea that is badly implemented.the PC that holds starter is a basic barebones box that is used for nothing more serious than email browsing by your half blind ethiopian auntie.  and thats all she needs it for, she doesn't have to undertsand PC's so while saying yeah but they may wish to upgrade, it's highly unlikely.My TV won't take HDMI inputs, and while HDMI hasn't phased out SCART RGB just yet, it will i'm pretty sure.  so i'll have to upgrade my TV if i want something better.  People will just have to upgrade their OS if they want something beter.  as i said this is a stupid non issue that /. and co have tried to make something big out of it.

  • User profile image
    Manip

    Na, I disagree, it IS a big deal because it just shows Microsoft's view of their users and how they view Windows (a way to control people).

    This isn't that far away from Microsoft restricting Longhorn to Intel CPUs only, for example.

    PS- That TV analogy is stupid because it's completely different.

  • User profile image
    Maurits

    This is an excellent example of development effort (which costs money) being spent to make a product LESS convenient for customers.  This is somewhat unnatural, and thus hard to justify, especially to developers.

  • User profile image
    DoomBringer

    It is probably being blown out of proportion (it is OEM only, so no one will run into the problem, in theory), but I don't like it.  Unless there is an underlying, real, reason to limit use on that chip, then fine.  But I doubt it.

  • User profile image
    Shaded

    Manip wrote:

    An operating system is supposed to provide the most efficient access to the hardware possible. That is a fundamental of any operating system however well or badly they do so. But in starter edition they *intentionally limit the ability of the hardware below what it is capable of.


    If this were true, Windows Server would never exist and every PC station would be capable of hosting active directory.



    Manip wrote:


    Jaz: But the Celeron and P4 work in the same socket, so why can't people upgrade?

    Note: Microsoft are always being evil. Look at C9 for example, it was supposed to be a transparent Microsoft, but now we know that is an illusion and it is about PR (see Scoble's posts).


    This reminds me of all the kids that post content that is against the law on the internet and cry "Freedom of Speech!" when they're caught. (Something America's founding fathers were big on.)  This is complete peversion of the use of terms.

    Just because Microsoft isin't telling you the secrets you want to know in Channel 9 does not mean they aren't being transparent and therefore are evil.

    Who is being evil here....

    Microsoft offers an operating system that is completely optional to customers in poor countries.  Now these people are suppose to complain about limitations because they can afford $80 for a current processor but they can't afford to buy Windows?

    PUH-lease.  This is like those Davidians in Waco Texas claiming "freedom of religion."

  • User profile image
    Jaz

    they're selling a version of windows thats restricted from the offset, software wise, and is cheap made for cheap PC's for low income families who aren't running vissual studio 2005 or probably playing doom3 all day.  They're fair and just in doing this. in my eyes anyhow.

    i don't agree with their tactics, but i do understand them.  it's only sold to computer makers (i think) and thus only low spec PC's will get it.  please tell me manip, do you really think that the typical user (half blind, deaf in one ear, 70 year old ethiopian grandmother) is really gonna want to upgrade their PC or know howto? 

    ok i know my grandfather used to have the latest machines back in the day (always got powerful 286's and onwards) because he liked flight sim games,  and there are exceptions to the rules, but for the set of users this is aimed at, running a P4 or Athlon doesn't matter.


    Edit - see now this would be a goodtime for some insight from MS India

  • User profile image
    Manip

    Jaz wrote:
    please tell me manip, do you really think that the typical user (half blind, deaf in one ear, 70 year old ethiopian grandmother) is really gonna want to upgrade their PC or know howto? 


    Yes I do. I *know* they do. I have done some myself.

    Shaded wrote:
    If this were true, Windows Server would never exist and every PC station would be capable of hosting active directory.


    Stupidest example ever! Active Directory is a feature, not an extension of the frigging hardware. I am talking about CPU virtualisation, not feature set!

  • User profile image
    W3bbo

    Perhaps, but what good does unnecesarily crippling an OS do?

    3 programs with 3 windows each at once?
    Only uber-low-end CPUs?
    "Classic" windows shell which is (arguably) harder for a newbie to get to grips with than that "big green button" and "Rover" (the only time I'll ever say it's use is a good idea)

    Microsoft is seriously underestimating their consumers here.

  • User profile image
    Maurits

    Manip wrote:

    Shaded wrote: If this were true, Windows Server would never exist and every PC station would be capable of hosting active directory.
    Stupidest example ever! Active Directory is a feature, not an extension of the frigging hardware. I am talking about CPU virtualisation, not feature set!



    Manip, Manip... where is that LART now that I need it? Wink
    It's a fair point.  Actually I wouldn't mind being able to host Active Directory on a workstation flavor of the OS.  It would make migrating servers a lot easier:
    • Come in on the weekend
    • Back up the directory
    • DCPromo my workstation
    • Move all the roles to my workstation
    • Do whatever I had to do to the servers
    • Reverse the DCPromo / role move process
    • UnDCPromo my workstation
    bada-bing, bada-boom!

  • User profile image
    Jaz

    Manip wrote:
    Jaz wrote: please tell me manip, do you really think that the typical user (half blind, deaf in one ear, 70 year old ethiopian grandmother) is really gonna want to upgrade their PC or know howto? 


    Yes I do. I *know* they do. I have done some myself.



    sorry what, you've flown to ethiopia just to upgrade some processors.

  • User profile image
    Manip

    Jaz, don't play that silly game, giving the obviously most unlikely example (and unrealistic) one ever and then pick at it like you won because nobody can live up to it.

    As you know, I have upgraded some older people's PCs in this country including the CPU.

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