Coffeehouse Thread

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Canadians elect Conservative majority

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  • User profile image
    Richard.Hein

    OK, so it's all but over, and we've elected the Progressive Conservative party into a majority government, after the last two elections gave them only a minority government.  So, I hope the conservatives stay level headed and don't do anything extreme, because I agree with their economic policy and think that without the conservative party in power during the worldwide economic "downturn" we'd all be in worse shape.  It's clear that Canada has become more polarized, however, with the Liberal party losing so many seats and the NDP, the most left-wing and socialist party in Canada, having the best result in their history.  The Bloc, a Quebec-only and separatist party has lost the most - having only 2 seats (the final number remains to be seen) left, forcing them to lose their official party status for the first time in my lifetime (or at least, my memory).  Big surprise in Quebec.  The NDP gained most in Quebec, stealing most of Quebec from the Bloc.

    Just sayin', eh?

  • User profile image
    W3bbo

    Isn't "Progressive Conservative" an oxymoron?

  • User profile image
    Richard.Hein

    @W3bbo: Only in the US.  In Canada, the Conservative party is very much centrist compared to the Republicans.

    Of course, my NDP friends disagree; but they think the government should take care of everything with money that doesn't exist and don't realize what Carbon Tax and Cap and Trade really mean.

  • User profile image
    brian.​shapiro

    , Richard.Hein wrote

    @W3bbo: Only in the US.  In Canada, the Conservative party is very much centrist compared to the Republicans.

    Of course, my NDP friends disagree; but they think the government should take care of everything with money that doesn't exist and don't realize what Carbon Tax and Cap and Trade really mean.

    There are some in the US who call themselves progressive conservatives. And McCain calls himself a Theodore Roosevelt -style Republican, who himself was the definition of a progressive conservative.

  • User profile image
    W3bbo

    , brian.​shapiro wrote

    There are some in the US who call themselves progressive conservatives. And McCain calls himself a Theodore Roosevelt -style Republican, who himself was the definition of a progressive conservative.

    "Progressive" means progress, which implies change, but "conservative" comes from "maintaining the status-quo", that's why (as far as etymology is concerned) it doesn't make much sense from me.

    When used politically it implies using right-wing ideologies or centrist practices to advance a social-justice or "compassionate libertarian" agenda, right?

  • User profile image
    brian.​shapiro

    , W3bbo wrote

    *snip*

    "Progressive" means progress, which implies change, but "conservative" comes from "maintaining the status-quo", that's why (as far as etymology is concerned) it doesn't make much sense from me.

    When used politically it implies using right-wing ideologies or centrist practices to advance a social-justice or "compassionate libertarian" agenda, right?

    Not necessarily. The original progressives -- Theodore Roosevelt progressives -- were politically conservative and pro-business. What they argued for was that conservative values could be used to achieve liberal ends.. the word 'progressive' here was used in contrast to 'radical', meaning they wanted progressive changes rather than radical changes.

    What they were 'conservative' about in the process was a belief in the Constitution, traditional moral values, a work ethic, etc., rather than having them thrown out.

  • User profile image
    Minh

    In politics, you'll soon realize words don't mean anything.

    not to say that they're aren't a$$holes & saints in politics, there are, you're just going to have to work to find them

  • User profile image
    cbae

    , brian.​shapiro wrote

    *snip*

    There are some in the US who call themselves progressive conservatives. And McCain calls himself a Theodore Roosevelt -style Republican, who himself was the definition of a progressive conservative.

    McCain can call himself whatever he wants. It doesn't mean that he actually is what he says he is. Smiley

  • User profile image
    brian.​shapiro

    , cbae wrote

    *snip*

    McCain can call himself whatever he wants. It doesn't mean that he actually is what he says he is. Smiley

    Why not? He would agree with Theodore Roosevelt on most things. He's a conservationist, supports government reform, a strong foreign policy, both complained about judicial activism, etc... The thing he would disagree with him on is trade policy, but in each case their trade policy position was considered to be pro-business at the time. 100 years ago protectionism was seen as pro-business, now its free trade.

    The progressives were actually the moderate conservatives of their time. It was only later did the term get taken over by the left.

    I personally think McCain is a bit of a hack and only takes positions because he thinks they'll be popular... I don't see him as a real reformer, in the way TR was. But that doesn't mean the label he's applying to himself doesn't match his positions.

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