Coffeehouse Thread

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Justifying Windows Phone 7 development?

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  • User profile image
    SuperSpit

    Windows Phone 7 as far as i can see is the best looking platform and thought-out platform out there, but will that be enough. I ‘m afraid its got a big uphill struggle just from the point of how established the iphone and android are. Just ask my daughter
    what phone she wants and is prepared to spend her hard earned £480 on. It isn’t the Windows Phone 7!

    I think Microsoft need to

    1.       Get a better marketing department. They really do have the world’s worst marketing department don’t they!

    2.       Give a phone to whoever wants one. I know there pockets are only so deep. But they need to get the phone in people’s hands and I mean a lot of people. Maybe A “trade you old phone for a windows Mobile 7” campaign.

    Don’t get me wrong i really want to develop for this phone. And I probably will. But I can only go so far without the hardware. Am i prepared to spend money on a phone? If there’re a couple of hundred pounds then maybe but anything over that not until I
    can see a return in my investment. (My daughter has more disposable income than I do and she’s only 15) I also sent an email and never heard anything, but at this stage I don’t think Microsoft can be to choosy.

    Just my 2c worth

    Johnny

  • User profile image
    Tomservo

    Yeah. That's why I was clamoring for a phone. The application's practically ready, I just want it tested on real hardware, before I inadvertedly put something underperforming on the marketplace. I'm creating bitmaps on the fly with a certain framerate, and
    I'm not sure whether an actual phone can hold up with it (well, you know, .NET's integer arrays versus pointers in C).

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k3fLPgJX7g0

    Earlier I was hacking away on a mobile DJing application, until I randomly felt the urge to actually benchmark the MP3 decoder written in C# that I was using (no APIs to use the very likely way faster system codecs), ending up with 7x decode speed on actual
    computer hardware. And the application needed to run up to four decoding instances (two decks playing and rendering a proxy for displaying ahead of time), _on the phone_. I'm glad I didn't go ahead, because that'd have been a futile exercise.

    http://storageserver.be/images/pocketdj.jpg

    Now I feel that the FFT and bitmap generation has a similar effect. Because the app bar opening and closing animations jitter when the application's active. But hey, how do I test this, apart from real hardware?

    --edit: What is it with the post editor inserting blank lines left and right?!

  • User profile image
    vesuvius

    @Chadk: I hate to say it, but, that I think this is a good idea...why?

    You can fully develop a Window Phone 7 application that runs in the emulator on your machine, you you have a rich environment as a hobbyist. If you then think the world needs the application, then you can look at taking the steps to release it.

    That way, when someone browses the WP7 application store, they are guaranteed a high quality experience, I lose attention after 5 minutes on Google's Android marketplace.

    Look at codeplex, sourceforge or codeproject. There is a lot of good stuff there almost drowned by pet projects and incomplete "hobbyists" projects. This is way of having a measure of quality control, however frustrating, it will result in a far better end user experience.

    This is the reason why,for instance, Dr Herbie suscribes to Visual Studio magazine, to get well thought out and written articles, as apposed to the half baked badly written material in the blogoshere.

  • User profile image
    Dr Herbie

    @vesuvius:  While I agree that putting a price on entry to the app store will keep the quality bar high, I don't like that I cannot write apps for
    myself without paying MS an annual fee.

    I expect this is to prevent a 'side load' market from springing up, but I think they should give some regard to the hobbyist market.  Currently, I believe, students can unlock a single phone for free (and put apps on the market for free).  They should give
    a free 'hobbyist' license where you can unlock a single phone, but you can't use the market.  This will allow people to write apps for their own personal use on their own phones. The license would enable MS to keep track of the hobbyists and perhaps even sign apps with the license details so they know where they originated from.

    Herbie

  • User profile image
    Tomservo

    With the tools being free, a limit of 10 was to be expected. Otherwise, people would just put up either the source code or even ready to be deployed XAPs.

    On the other hand, unless Microsoft prohibits applications that run "plugins", I can see some application acting as assembly downloader and launcher, to sideload stuff. Actually, I think they're going to prevent this really hard from reaching the marketplace.

  • User profile image
    vesuvius

    @Dr Herbie: I agree entirely here, but in this, a launch version, I think that they are solely concentrating on the lowest common denominator.

     

    It would be nice to facilitate hobbyists installing applications on their own phones, but this early on in the game, they should concentrate on bigger business, as they are the ones most likely to create applications that the masses will use, consequently, exacerbating the aggrandisement of the platform.

     

    There will always be hobbyists that go on to make a million, maybe even 10 million, but if you are a hobbyist, and create a good application that you feel can sell, then it is well worth raising the fee (that is what hosting a website would cost).

     

    With cloud computing etc. Microsoft is trying to become the 'web-host for the world' for desktop, web and mobile platforms, with the subscription feature
    central to the realisation of their goals.

     

    Microsoft as you are no doubt aware always tend to make commercial decisions first, then worry about hobbyists afterwards.

  • User profile image
    magicalclick

    , Dr Herbie wrote

    @vesuvius:  While I agree that putting a price on entry to the app store will keep the quality bar high, I don't like that I cannot write apps for
    myself without paying MS an annual fee.

    I expect this is to prevent a 'side load' market from springing up, but I think they should give some regard to the hobbyist market.  Currently, I believe, students can unlock a single phone for free (and put apps on the market for free).  They should give
    a free 'hobbyist' license where you can unlock a single phone, but you can't use the market.  This will allow people to write apps for their own personal use on their own phones. The license would enable MS to keep track of the hobbyists and perhaps even sign apps with the license details so they know where they originated from.

    Herbie

    XNA club is 90bucks a year, and still tons and tons of indie games on XBL. I think the encouragement is, don't make an app for yourself, make an app for the community.

    Leaving WM on 5/2018 if no apps, no dedicated billboards where I drive, no Store name.
    Last modified
  • User profile image
    Chadk

    @vesuvius:

    I'd start writing applications to sell in a heart-beat, but given the fact that all predictions says that the adoption of WP7 will be rather low, I do not have confidence in the platform to take off, enough that it's worth me spending time on supporting an application that was only intended to be an application for me, even if I'm sure other people would like it.

    It's a chicken and egg problem.

  • User profile image
    Ian2

    I was lucky and managed to get a device last month (though I have to say I was pretty persistent).

    I've been doing a little contract work and filling in the gaps with app development for WP7 & I have to say it has been great fun! 

    I don't anticipate making 'a lot' of money from the apps, but I believe the platform has a secure future and is worth investing in.  I'm also hopeful that the marketplace will expand onto the forthcoming new Windows Tablets - so there will be additional opportunities for developers there.. 

    And eventually the Corporate world will catch up and the result will be plenty of opportunities for Silverlight developers!

     

    IMO The traditional PC/Laptop market is on the decline, mobiles & sleek tablets are the future!

    Yes, I've always been an optimist! 

  • User profile image
    martofsky

    Nice.. my critical comments were deleted. This thing is going to be a huge success.

    Way to go WP7!!! You guys are the best! Your phones will be flying off the shelves!

  • User profile image
    Skriker V1.0

    @Chadk: Since its based on WPF/Silverlight you can take the skills you learn to Windows desktop/web, cant see the harm in learning this stuff, I live Objective C Wink

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