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SL5 looks great but.

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  • User profile image
    magicalclick

    But, it seems like web is adapting SL slower than it should. Does SL missing something? Like, why I haven't seen much SL games on the web? Shouldn't there be some company making game with it on web?

    Leaving WM on 5/2018 if no apps, no dedicated billboards where I drive, no Store name.
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  • User profile image
    battlebottle

    i would suspect the reason is almost entirely due to the Silverlight install base being significantly lower than flash. according to riastats.com silverlight has a 67% install base compared with 97% for flash.

    I think being able to far more easily find experienced programmers designers for flash is a factor but primarily the install base is the big reason. most people won't want to install a plug-in to check out a games website and if they're at work they won't be able to if Silverlight hasn't been pre-installed most of the time. even if they do install silverlight they'll find the site won't work on various other computers that they use and may stop using the site for that reason.

    There's not many things you can do in silverlight at the moment in regards to games that you can't do in flash. So there's no compelling business reason to use silverlight over flash for most companies.

    Microsoft are well aware of these things I think and are focusing on gaps in the market such as business applications. Though I think when Silverlight start's to reach critical mass of 90-95% or so install base we'll start to see sites adopt it far more frequently. imho.

  • User profile image
    Cream​Filling512

    If they really want it to take off, add some Flash support to Silverlight.

  • User profile image
    bitdisaster

    Watch the presentation from Tim Heuer at the Firestarter Event about the install experience with Silverlight. Each Silverlight developer can do his part of spreading Silverlight by providing a smooth and compelling install/upgrade experience of the Silverlight runtime.

  • User profile image
    CKurt

    ...but I'm missing the third screen in the "3 screens and a cloud" vision. Where is silverlight for TV? Silverlight for Xbox ?

  • User profile image
    Harlequin

    @CreamFilling512:Well Silverlight offline can already use the browser control to host Flash inside of it. They just need to get that browser control to work in the browser where it's actually useful.

  • User profile image
    raymond

    Microsoft needs to get the Expression Studio into the schools and colleges and expand the application suite especially for video and audio editing.

    Adobe dominates multimedia authoring software: Photoshop, Illustrator, InDesign, Flash,  Dreamweaver, Fireworks, Premiere Pro, AfterEffects, just to name a few.

    Suggestion: give the Expression Studio to every school and college and educator that wants to teach courses using Expression Studio along with Visual Studio and SQL Server.

    If you only have the budget for one software suite, which do you buy?

    Adobe Creative Suite 5 Master Collection ($2,599)

    http://www.adobe.com/products/creativesuite/mastercollection/

    or

    Microsoft Expression Studio Ultimate ($599)

     http://www.microsoft.com/expression/

    Colleges invariably go the Adobe route as do businesses and individuals.

    This is Microsoft's challenge as well as Silverlight's.

    While I have been trying to get the Expression Studio into a local community college, it will not happen given budgetary constraints and Adobe's dominance of the multimedia software applications market.

    The Expression Suite is missing for example a competiting product to Adobe's Premiere Pro and AfterEffects.

    Do not forgot that Microsoft had the opportunity to purchase Macromedia (Flash,Fireworks) as well as YouTube and passed.

    It will take at least twenty years and a twenty billion dollars investment for Microsoft to catchup and pass Adobe.

    I am not convinced that Microsoft will make such a commitment of resources and talent.

    Instead it will continue to milk the cash cows of Windows and Office.

    It is a shame for Microsoft's Expression Studio could have been a contender against Adobe Creative Master Collection.

    Cool

    PS

    I would include in one of the skews for Expression Studio both Visual Studio and SQL Server.

    I am fully aware that students can get most of Microsoft's software for free:

    https://www.dreamspark.com/default.aspx

    and the WebsiteSpark 

    http://www.microsoft.com/web/websitespark/

    I have passed these links to many of my friends and students.

    The challenge is to get the colleges and universities to offer courses that use the Microsoft multimedia software and developer tools.

    Most of the multimedia and mass communications students are taking courses where the applications they are using in the course are invariably Adobe and not Microsoft with the majority of the students totally unaware of Microsoft's Expression Studio.

    The students use Adobe Photoshop, Premiere Pro, After Effects, Flash, Dreamweaver, Fireworks, Illustrator and Audition which I use as well.

    The only Microsoft products that they use are Microsoft Office mainly Word and PowerPoint.

    For example the web programming instructor who is a friend of mine has being teaching both JavaScript and PHP for many years in the multimedia department.

    He uses Visual Studio, ASP.NET, and C# at the large Fortune 500 company he works for during the day.

    This company is in the process of converting its older ColdFusion applications into ASP.NET.

    He is also aware that students can get the software for free, I told him and gave him the above link as well as the webspark link.

    I asked him last week if he was going to be teaching ASP.NET using C# and SQL Server in the spring for he indicated that he was going to last summer.

    His response was he will be teaching PHP again next year.

    He did not want to fight the uphill battle to get Visual Studio and SQL Server into the classrooms and multimedia lab.

    Since the department has expanded into the game area, I suggested that he talk to the new game programming instructor that is using XNA Game Studio for the game programming courses.

    I suggested that both of them push for Visual Studio, SQL Server and Expression Studio for the web design and development courses.

    As for Expression Studio the department listens to an advisory board where few if any of the board members are using Expression Studio in the companies they work for.

    The Computer Science Department is a lost cause for they teach C++ and Java for all credit courses and will not teach either C# or Visual Basic until the senior universities or four year colleges require them to switch to C# and/or Visual Basic.

    The only place you will find an ASP.NET, SQL Server, C# and Visual Basic courses are the non-credit Continuing Education/Workforce Development courses at this community college.

    Keep in mind that this community college is one of the largest and best in Texas if not the United States.

    What is needed besides expanding the scope of the Expression Studio application suite into video and audio is a concerted effort by Microsoft Evangelists to reach out to the colleges and universities across the nation. 

    Make the faculty and students totally aware of the various multimedia applications, developer tools and courseware material that is available from Microsoft.

    In addition to developers attending Microsoft events have the Microsoft Evangelists visit colleges and universities several time each year demonstrating Microsoft software to both students and faculty.

     2005 Version

    "I couldn't have said it better myself."

     

    2010 Version

     

    "What good is dreaming it if you don't actually do it?" 

    Cool 

     

  • User profile image
    battlebottle

    @raymond:

    I wouldn't have considered adobe master collection to be, in any significant way, competing with the expression suite. The expression suite, as far as i understand it and i may be wrong, is primarily designed for designing/developing application in the form of websites, wpf and silverlight applications. The adobe master collection is far more broadly aimed at the multi media industry. There are products there for professional level film editing, special effects, sound editing, graphic design and illustration. Dreamweaver, flash and flex are the only things there application related but Dreamweaver and flash i would consider far more designer focused than anything in expression given there is much less focus on the programming environment. flex is the exception here.

    Microsoft have no product that competes in any way with photoshop, premier, after effects, encore, illustrator or soundbooth. They have some products that have similar functionality but are not in any way aimed at professionals. Also expression blend allows you to import artwork from photoshop and illustrator, so I've always imagined Microsoft for hoping professional designers to use the expression suite with they're existing tools as opposed to replacing them.

     

  • User profile image
    figuerres

     

    as for getting the tools in the schools -  Microsoft Acedemic pricing should fix the cost part.

    any legit Non-Profit - like a church for example; or any school can get way cheap prices for any MS software, all they have to do is ask for it.  for example if you have an account with CDW just ask for the academic price list.

    i am not sure what they do on expression but office pro is around $50 for a school or a church

  • User profile image
    Bass

    , raymond wrote

    Microsoft needs to get the Expression Studio into the schools and colleges and expand the application suite especiallly for video and audio editing.

    Adobe dominates multimedia authoring software: Photoshop, Illustrator, InDesign, Flash,  Dreamweaver, Fireworks, Premiere Pro, AfterEffects, just to name a few.

    Suggestion: give the Expression Studio to every school and college and educator that wants to teach courses using Expression Studio along with Visual Studio and SQL Server.

    If you only have the budget for one software suite, which do you buy?

    Adobe Creative Suite 5 Master Collection ($2,599)

    http://www.adobe.com/products/creativesuite/mastercollection/

    or

    Microsoft Expression Studio Ultimate ($599)

     http://www.microsoft.com/expression/

    Colleges invariably go the Adobe route as do businesses and individuals.

    This is Microsoft's challenge as well as Silverlight's.

    While I have been trying to get the Expression Studio into a local community college, it will not happen given budgetary constraints and Adobe's dominance of the multimedia software applications market.

    The Expression Suite is missing for example a competiting product to Adobe's Premiere Pro and AfterEffects.

    Do not forgot that Microsoft had the opportunity to purchase Macromedia (Flash,Fireworks) as well as YouTube and passed.

    It will take at least twenty years and a twenty billion dollars investment for Microsoft to catchup and pass Adobe.

    I am not convinced that Microsoft will make such a commitment of resources and talent.

    Instead it will continue to milk the cash cows of Windows and Office.

    It is a shame for Microsoft's Expression Studio could have been a contender against Adobe Creative Master Collection.

    [quote]

     

    , raymond wrote

    Microsoft needs to get the Expression Studio into the schools and colleges and expand the application suite especiallly for video and audio editing.

    Adobe dominates multimedia authoring software: Photoshop, Illustrator, InDesign, Flash,  Dreamweaver, Fireworks, Premiere Pro, AfterEffects, just to name a few.

    Suggestion: give the Expression Studio to every school and college and educator that wants to teach courses using Expression Studio along with Visual Studio and SQL Server.

    If you only have the budget for one software suite, which do you buy?

    Adobe Creative Suite 5 Master Collection ($2,599)

    http://www.adobe.com/products/creativesuite/mastercollection/

    or

    Microsoft Expression Studio Ultimate ($599)

     http://www.microsoft.com/expression/

    Colleges invariably go the Adobe route as do businesses and individuals.

    This is Microsoft's challenge as well as Silverlight's.

    While I have been trying to get the Expression Studio into a local community college, it will not happen given budgetary constraints and Adobe's dominance of the multimedia software applications market.

    The Expression Suite is missing for example a competiting product to Adobe's Premiere Pro and AfterEffects.

    Do not forgot that Microsoft had the opportunity to purchase Macromedia (Flash,Fireworks) as well as YouTube and passed.

    It will take at least twenty years and a twenty billion dollars investment for Microsoft to catchup and pass Adobe.

    I am not convinced that Microsoft will make such a commitment of resources and talent.

    Instead it will continue to milk the cash cows of Windows and Office.

    It is a shame for Microsoft's Expression Studio could have been a contender against Adobe Creative Master Collection.

     

    Cool

     

    , raymond wrote

    Microsoft needs to get the Expression Studio into the schools and colleges and expand the application suite especiallly for video and audio editing.

    Adobe dominates multimedia authoring software: Photoshop, Illustrator, InDesign, Flash,  Dreamweaver, Fireworks, Premiere Pro, AfterEffects, just to name a few.

    Suggestion: give the Expression Studio to every school and college and educator that wants to teach courses using Expression Studio along with Visual Studio and SQL Server.

    If you only have the budget for one software suite, which do you buy?

    Adobe Creative Suite 5 Master Collection ($2,599)

    http://www.adobe.com/products/creativesuite/mastercollection/

    or

    Microsoft Expression Studio Ultimate ($599)

     http://www.microsoft.com/expression/

    Colleges invariably go the Adobe route as do businesses and individuals.

    This is Microsoft's challenge as well as Silverlight's.

    While I have been trying to get the Expression Studio into a local community college, it will not happen given budgetary constraints and Adobe's dominance of the multimedia software applications market.

    The Expression Suite is missing for example a competiting product to Adobe's Premiere Pro and AfterEffects.

    Do not forgot that Microsoft had the opportunity to purchase Macromedia (Flash,Fireworks) as well as YouTube and passed.

    It will take at least twenty years and a twenty billion dollars investment for Microsoft to catchup and pass Adobe.

    I am not convinced that Microsoft will make such a commitment of resources and talent.

    Instead it will continue to milk the cash cows of Windows and Office.

    It is a shame for Microsoft's Expression Studio could have been a contender against Adobe Creative Master Collection.

     

    Cool

     

    At the college level for computer science departments don't usually have to pay ANYTHING for Microsoft software. There is a program called MSDN Academic Alliance which provides both the school and all the students (CS only) a collection of free Microsoft software to include Visual Studio and Expression Blend.

  • User profile image
    magicalclick

    @raymond:

    It is already free using Acdemic Alience program. I have it free already. But, no teacher use it. To be exact, no teacher use C# to begin with.

    Leaving WM on 5/2018 if no apps, no dedicated billboards where I drive, no Store name.
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  • User profile image
    DarkSilver

    As mentioned schools/students have free edtions of the Expression Studio through http://www.dreamspark.com - in addition to that small startup companies can join http://www.websitespark.com and recieve Expression Studio as well as Visual Studio, SQL Server and more at close to no cost at all. There is not another company in the world that does more for developers than Microsoft. 

    As for not enough Silverlight apps/games.. stop complaining about it and make something already.. what are you waiting for??  Compare adoption rates with Flash all you like (Flash has been around close to what 20 years??), anyone notice that Silverlight adoption is dead even/nudging past Java?? 

    No teacher uses C#?? I teach.. I teach C#.. well okay I am by some considered a nobody but, I know my Mother would disagree at least Wink

    After a few cracks at doing a full Silverlight site (I kept approaching my designs like I was working in Flash) I finally came up with something creative: http://www.darksilver.ca

    Silverlight and Expression Blead are amazing.. if we build it.. well you know the rest..

    Mike

     

     

     

     

     

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