Coffeehouse Thread

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Very tired

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  • cheong

    Very busy after the week of annual leave...

    27 working hours for the 2 workdays passed... and this week I'm in long weekend schedule...

    There's good chance I'll have 60+ work hours this week...

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  • contextfree`

    Take care of yourself!

  • RLO

    I hate it when I take time off, and the time I take off is lost because of the workload I face when returning.

    If you are really under that type of pressure, they don't have enough people working for them, or your manager hasn't planned projects with leave time in mind.

    I have been lucky to work for some great people that when I had to go that extra mile, there was extra rest to compensate.

    Good luck on your project, and hope you get the well deserved rest you have earned when it's completed.

     

     

  • cheong

    @RLO: Well, the problem is that each member in my team is responsible for different modules, and don't have knowledge of work others working on.

    And there's new module launching for my team this Monday, so lots of bugfixes are logged.

    Btw, according to department meeting last month, 80% of teams (about 10) in my department have 1-2 vacancies in them, and most of the team size is 2-6 people. So there's really manpower shortage everywhere.

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  • Harlequin

    Meh...I did 12+ hours straight for 30 straight days to get a project done once....you get used to it, albeit you do start to die inside in many ways Smiley

  • Kental2

    It can be nice sometimes, I find.  I mean sure, it can be stressful and headache inducing and tiring and all that, but I never feel team spirit and camaraderie as strongly as I do when 40+ people pull together over a month to pull off a new release or product launch and make it go smoothly.

    Sort of the reason I keep developing Smiley  I enjoy the work, it's more like fun-time than work time, but even when things get intense it still has a payout at the end of the day.  No other job like it imo, though I might be biased Wink

  • Deactivated User

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  • Dr Herbie

    If a developer is working extensive overtime, then it means that the project manager has f---ed up and you're just paying for his mistake. Do you get paid overtime?

    Herbie

  • Harlequin

    Depends on where you live I would guess....I know in B.C. the laws say you don't get OT for the tech industry.

  • ScanIAm

    , Harlequin wrote

    Depends on where you live I would guess....I know in B.C. the laws say you don't get OT for the tech industry.

    if you are billing by the hour (as a consultant or consulting company), you can be damn sure they are getting paid for that time, so if you aren't getting some leave or other compensation, you are being taken advantage of.

    That said, there is an extreme dev shortage all over.  Meanwhile, projects still need to get done and there apparently ISN'T a shortage of incompetent project managers.

  • kettch

    @ScanIAm: I think people often underestimate the value of a good project manager. They think in terms of project manager == manager == boss. You end up with some mid-level type who pokes his head into the developers' area once in a while to make sure they have their IDE open.

    A lot of companies seem to just take it in stride that their project management will be terrible and things will look ok until "crunch time". What follows is always a panicked rush of overtime, even though they anticipated the panic.

  • Kental2

    I've often thought about that, Kettch. A lot of times people think management experience means a person will be a competent manager for ANY profession, but I don't think software developers (and software development in general) works the same way.  Not only will incompetence be brutal in software development, developers will probably be far less satisfied having to deal with an incompetent boss or one that doesn't understand what software development entails.

    From my personal experience/history, this is usually expressed by an incompetent manager asking why a feature can't be done in 2 hours instead of 2 weeks, because they have no fundamental understanding of what it takes to do the job.  

  • kettch

    @Kental2: I think that a really good project manager doesn't really need to have an understanding of how long it will take to write feature 'x'. It's the developer's job to know how long it will take, and it's the business analyst's job to properly document specifications and requirements so that the developers can properly estimate.

    Where I work, we're about half way through a multi-year implementation project. The project manager started out with no history in IT. However, he had a record of the projects he's managed for some Fortune 500 companies and the military. Watching him work, I realized that he didn't really need a solid understanding of the nuts and bolts. He abstracted the high level components and worked at that level to make sure that the developers, DBAs, business analysts, customers, and vendor all kept moving along.

  • vesuvius

    @cheong: When you are younger, your body can take it, and you effectively are learning on the job. 60 hours is not a lot if you are >35, if you said 80 hours, then I might start to acknowledge that you are working very hard.

    After a while, you will find most of the time, removing yourself from the problems, having a long break, and doing other things like hobbies helps solve problems that world take 120hrs in a week.

    If it is a short term project 3-9 months, and you have had a month or two off, then it is manageable, being relaxed and stress free is the secret.

  • evildictait​or

    Harlequin wrpte: Depends on where you live I would guess....I know in B.C. the laws say you don't get OT for the tech industry

    WTF? How can the law say what your boss is allowed to pay you?

  • ScanIAm

    , evildictait​or wrote

    *snip*

    WTF? How can the law say what your boss is allowed to pay you?

    That's not what he meant.

    It's the same in the US.  Some jobs are classified so that employers MUST pay for overtime.  Tech workers are usually exempt from that because they are hired as 'salary'.

  • cheong

    @Harlequin:Many other countries say that as well.

    Btw, for my company we don't get OT but have compensation leave instead. On some other companies I worked for, we didn't have compensation leaves that never got approved and always expire. So I guess my current one is better... at least I did actually have my compensation leave once. Tongue Out

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  • kettch

    I work for a local government, and we're all salaried. There's no OT or official provision for compensation leave. Our stupid payroll system requires us to fill out a time tracking form, even for salaried employees. So, everybody has to fill out 8's all the way across. Since we're IT folk, we'll work too much if we get into something. Unofficially, as long as we don't save it for too long, we can announce we've been there too long that week and take off early. You still have to fill out 10 8's M-F.

    I've done the death march thing. It results in shitty code and should never be done.

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