Coffeehouse Thread

25 posts

Windows Blue should bring back the DVD codecs

Back to Forum: Coffeehouse
  • User profile image
    DeathBy​VisualStudio

    , evildictait​or wrote

    *snip*

    I'm not interested that Microsoft makes mistakes. I'm interested why they make mistakes. That is why I am much more interested in asking "what is the thought process that led to this action" than just pointing at their mistakes and saying "Hah! Microsoft is going to die!"

    And yet you constantly reframe valid issues that people bring up just in the negative with such recasting of their ideas as "Hah! Microsoft is going to die!". It's pretty clear you don't ask "why". You do you best in defaming the original issue. 

    I never said on this thread that Microsoft should all be giving themselves a pat on the back for removing the codecs, or that putting them back in is impossible. I just want to get this into your head: Every Change Has Consequences. This is true at Microsoft and it's also true everywhere else.

    If Microsoft puts codecs back into Windows, they will make their money back another way. And in business you make money by either charging more or by cutting costs.

    Right... So there is no point in bringing up issues with Microsoft's decisions or direction because in the end every change has its consequence. Got it. I'll keep aimlessly bringing up issues; you don't need to remind me that it's a lost cause.

    So it is utterly inconsistent to ask for expensive codecs to be added in on the one thread, complain that unused Microsoft features get dropped on another, and also then complain that Microsoft products are too expensive.

    Something has to give. You can't have all of those things.

    You're right; something has to give. I think it should be the price of Windows. They dropped their costs -- pass it on to the consumer. After all Windows 8 is a very unfinished product and if Microsoft was smart IMO they'd use price to try and retain their user base.

    Honestly I don't think you want to understand the argument here. You're just taking one aspect of it at a time and tearing it down. IMO there's three ways to look at this:

    1. Microsoft excludes the codecs and drops the price of Windows (because their COGs are lower).
    2. Microsoft includes the codecs and the price stays the same.
    3. Microsoft excludes the codecs and the price stays the same. Microsoft profits from reduced cost of manufacturing Windows.

    Options 1 & 2 are fine by me. Option 3 is less desirable and is the issue that is being brought up.

    If you bothered to think about seeing the world from Microsoft's perspective, you'd realize that you can get them to do stuff that you want them to do by phrasing your requests as a win-win.


    I see "we're saying it wrong". How about: "Microsoft should lower the price of Windows by excluding the DVD codecs OR Microsoft should include the DVD codecs and keep the price the same. Both approaches are a win/win because they appeal to the existing Windows user base, allow for quicker adoption, and help Microsoft sell more copies of Windows." 

    Frankly I think Bass's conclusion better reflects the reality here.

    I'm not "being a Microsoft protectionist". I'm trying to see the world as Microsoft sees it so I can understand their decisions better so I can plan for them, or intercept changes that I don't like coming by arguing it "in Microsoft-speak" before it happens.

    I'm sorry if that seems like a protectionist to you. But it's certainly more useful and more constructive than just stamping my feet and shouting "NO! MICROSOFT IS ALWAYS WRONG BECAUSE THEY ARE EVIL AND THEIR PRODUCTS SUCK" like some people on C9 of late.

    Sure you are. You assume the best intentions on Microsoft's part and respond with conflicting points when taking the issue as a whole. Your constant attack of anything that questions Microsoft's decision making is only further underscored by the recasting of peoples' remarks as "NO! MICROSOFT IS ALWAYS WRONG BECAUSE THEY ARE EVIL AND THEIR PRODUCTS SUCK". That's no different that people using "M$" as an abbreviation for Microsoft.

  • User profile image
    DeathBy​VisualStudio

    , jinx101 wrote

    Sure, they removed it because of cost.. but think about it, Windows 8 is tailored for tablets and not desktop users... tablets don't have DVD players, hence, drop the codec because MS isn't focusing on the desktop, this is just another illustration of that mentality.

    That makes sense but it also raises the broader question of what's happening to the desktop? Is it dead or are we just waiting until Windows 9 for desktop improvements? If the latter then will the DVD codecs return with Windows 9 or are they assuming DVDs in desktops dead even though they still ship with them today?

  • User profile image
    Deactivated User

    Comment removed at user's request.

  • User profile image
    Sven Groot

    , DeathBy​VisualStudio wrote

    *snip*

    That makes sense but it also raises the broader question of what's happening to the desktop? Is it dead or are we just waiting until Windows 9 for desktop improvements? If the latter then will the DVD codecs return with Windows 9 or are they assuming DVDs in desktops dead even though they still ship with them today?

    New Mac desktops are shipping without DVD drives already. They led the way on systems without floppy drives as well.

    Gives it a few years, and I think 95% of new desktops won't have optical drives. At least in those parts of the world that have decent internet connections.

  • User profile image
    Kental2

    If I'm being honest, I think I've actually put a CD or DVD in my blu-ray drive three times in the last two years.  And those were for particularly old games I couldn't get access to elsewhere.  Ironically, I've never once put a blu-ray disk in my blu-ray disk drive... I wonder if that should bother me.  Tongue Out

  • User profile image
    DeathBy​VisualStudio

    , Sven Groot wrote

    *snip*

    New Mac desktops are shipping without DVD drives already. They led the way on systems without floppy drives as well.

    Gives it a few years, and I think 95% of new desktops won't have optical drives. At least in those parts of the world that have decent internet connections.

    While that may true Windows 8 doesn't provide the same value for those buying PC's today (desktop or laptop) with DVD drives today. This certainly isn't the biggest issue with Windows 8 but it certainly is one of its "thousand little cuts" that IMO slows adoption at worst or provides for disappointment for some. I'd think there was some room for "understanding" if there was something amazing in Windows 8 for desktop and/or non-touch laptop users but IMO there's not.

    If we all believed in unicorns and fairies the world would be a better place.
    Last modified
  • User profile image
    Larry Osterman

    @Sven Groot:+1 this. Although I'm not totally happy that optical media is going away - it has its uses in certain scenarios (copying learning tracks so I can play them in the car for example). 

    I think there were a number of parts to the decision to remove the CSS codecs (although I don't have firm information). First off, many/most video cards already sell bundle playback software - that means that most customers already have DVD playback capabilities (I know that every video card I've bought in the past few years has come with a WinDVD copy). Second, an ever increasing percentage of Windows sales come from volume licensed customers and I believe that CSS is licensed on a per-unit basis (reference)- per-unit license fees are a challenge in a volume licensed world. Third (as several people have pointed out), shiny media is on the way out - more and more machines don't have shiny media drives these days and that trend is increasing, not decreasing - there's no point in buying a DVD playback license for a Surface RT or Surface Pro device after all.

    I actually like the solution MSFT came up with: Sell a low cost add-on which enables DVD playback for any customer that wants it and you're good.

    Having said that, one thing I'm upset about: Windows no longer have DVD burning in Windows 8 which means I can't create DVDs of the videos I take of my wife's chorus concert without using 3rd party software.

Comments closed

Comments have been closed since this content was published more than 30 days ago, but if you'd like to continue the conversation, please create a new thread in our Forums, or Contact Us and let us know.