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Bass Bass Knows the way the wind is flowing.
  • Modern Skype is dead.

    , magicalclick wrote

    @wastingtimewithforums:

    Actually most of the LOB applications ditched Win32. They look the same as Win32, but, they are C# .Net Apps in WinForm. On top of that, several years ago when I hunt around the sales-inventory solutions, aside from them all being .Net, some of them are fancy WPF and nice looking charts. Win32 in LOB has been long replaced by .Net and large percentage replaced by WPF.

    But, the reason is simple, going to .NET and WPF has zero risk to customer and product provider. Customer can use .NET 1 2 3, without any unexpected behavior and it runs on "XP!!!!!!".

    But, metor, modern, UA, UWPA are literally tard. And death of modern Skype proves that. Honestly I started this thread just thinking how stupid of MS to jump ship from their own modern platform. And now I got slapped with some insane truth about why modern platform remains as a joke. The joke is how volatile the platform truly is.

    WPF is proprietary, it has the same risks as the others you mentioned. Microsoft can simply kill it, or start charging $50,000 to use it, or whatever suits their current or future business goals (which does not always align with yours) and there is ZERO you can do about it. Thus making WPF a hard dependency of your software is extremely risky. Much of .NET these days however does not have this risk, but WPF does.

    I wouldn't even call it risky: the idea of building your intellectual property ontop of some other companies IP that you have zero leverage over is in all circumstances, asking for trouble in the future. It's not about a calculated risk, it's just stupid. It means you have little actual control over your own IP. Your control over your own technology is only as strong as your control over its dependencies.

    Some people are always doubters about this, but I get proven right time and time and time and time again. It's not that I have a crystal ball. It's just that I understand that a company is not a charity. They are only interested in your business as far as it suits their own. Once it's no longer necessary or possible to sell a proprietary platform, the vendor's interests will no longer align with your own - they have no need for that anymore.

  • Running Win 10 on the Raspberry Pi is nice and all, but check this

    No thanks. That breadboard didn't wire itself. You * up one thing and the whole system is fried with no way of knowing why. I'll stick to cryptic compiler errors thank you very much.

  • Modern Skype is dead.

    It's not the new APIs that are the hillarious thing (MS has a bazillion of them anyway) but Microsoft's repeated declarations that everything until metro/modern/winrt/ua/uwp/wtf is legacy and dead and what not is the funniest thing I've seen in IT for ages. It beats Stallman's foot fetish by a wide margin.



    Win32 is still around obviously. They need to keep it around so that the suckers who bought into proprietary years ago can't escape. I wouldn't surprised if Microsoft soon forces a special "legacy" version of Windows that is like four/five figures per desktop license cost just to drain all the possible money from the suckers. Consider how much Microsoft got paid for extended support for Windows XP. Taking advantage of API locked in organizations by forcing them into license agreements they can't refuse is not a new Microsoft invention by the way. It's a classic from all the major platform vendors.

    But Microsoft must be seen as de-emphasising of Win32 for the same exact reason they are keeping it around. Win32 is a major point of contention. As the case with any fully proprietary platform, it forces you into a potentially abusive business relationship essentially for the life of your software. The biggest fear of non-Microsoft IT decision makers is right there. Even those decision makers thinking in the short term mostly aren't that stupid anymore. Microsoft can not be seen as promoting lock in if they are to grow.

  • Modern Skype is dead.

     

    , wastingtime​withforums wrote

    *snip*

    It's funny that Microsoft itself became the carbon-copy of the tards of the past though.

    Microsoft is making amends with the technical community, that's why it might look like that to you. Maybe to you it's a bunch of "freetards", but go visit Hacker News or Reddit's tech subreddits some time, I've seen it personally, the opinion of Microsoft has increased over the last few years.

    Your opinion is irrelevant because you already tied yourself to Microsoft. Pleasing you is literally pointless. Microsoft is working only to please those not buying Microsoft, all their decisions must be looked through that lens.

  • Modern Skype is dead.

    @wastingtimewithforums:

    Quite frankly with all the bitching about Windows and threads and other crap that pollutes C9, I'm sure you still run Windows. You are almost religiously anti-Linux. I doubt you are an Apple user also. Microsoft thanks you. There is only one legit way to make Microsoft care and that's to stop giving them your business. Microsoft knows that you are too invested in the Microsoft ecosystem to leave and disregard pretty much everything you say as appropriate. You aren't going to leave the Microsoft system because you are both too used to Windows and probably developed a Win32-exclusive infrastructure. Microsoft doesn't owe you anything, you are already owned. It's like expecting good followup customer service after signing a lifetime contract.

    From my perspective Microsoft is doing a lot of things these days to make Windows a whole let less awful then it was. With SSH support and package management, with containers and puppet/chef support. I care about all these things.  But I don't care about Metro, I'm in a SSH session or IDE most of the time anyway. Why should I care about Metro? Microsoft's contributions to open source, it's massive these days. I care about that. There is a whole lot less for me to talk shiit about. What am I going to talk * about? The default color scheme? Seriously?

    Why do they care about pleasing me and not you? This should not be surprising. I'm not invested in Microsoft. I indirectly give money to their competitors, and recommend their competitors products. All the time. They are making this harder though. I can't be like Microsoft doesn't play well with other systems. It's harder to make that argument. That's the point. Their business strategy is to target people outside of Microsoft ecoystem, addressing the concerns of people who aren't dependent on Microsoft. The people who legit don't give them money, and are afraid of giving them money even when sometimes they legit have a better product, because they don't want to deal with the interoperability and lock in issues.

    Basically, they are catering to people like me. My concerns are driving Microsoft. Not yours. Their whole strategy revolves around making Windows more appealing to Linux and Apple users. Because quite frankly, we matter more. :)

  • Modern Skype is dead.

    wastingtimewithforums, package management is a legit reason on why Linux is better. One of my biggest pet peeves about Windows is how many apps essentially roll their own package management, and you have multiple "software updaters" running and bothering you. It's f*cking annoying. Apple and Adobe are especially bad, but it's not the point. It's not the right way of doing software lifecycle management. It's completely idiotic actually.

    If W10 solves this it would be a huge boon to Windows. How someone can complain about package management I don't understand. Even just having apt-get in Windows would be a huge advancement. But it even seems that Microsoft is going beyond copying apt-get. Microsoft is fixing a lot of the problems with mainstream Linux's package management. It's possible to break a system with a poorly designed RPM or DEB package. I've had it happen before. It's a fundamental design flaw in how these package systems work that is not easy to correct. They use full root to do their installation. I don't see how the same is possible with APPX. This whole APPX virtual FS thing looks more like NixOS then Ubuntu apt-get.

  • Modern Skype is dead.

    , TexasToast wrote

    @Bass:That sounds great and it would be nice if the world worked that why but it does not.

    It does. Lots of money is thrown into scientific advancement worldwide for instance.

  • Grrr. MSDN subscription downgraded from VS Ultimate to VS Professional - What will I lose?

    Interesting, it must have went down in price. I remember Ultimate costing ~$12k to buy not too long ago. I think perhaps your company was not the only one bailing on it. Still, a $1500 raise is still worth asking for. :)

  • Modern Skype is dead.

    , TexasToast wrote

    *snip*

    Rewriting and retargeting applications is how a lot of us make more money.   I am amazed on how many software developers talk about open source and Linux but never talk about how you do some work, package it and make money.  Many on here just like to be a laborer and have the man pay you for work and you are basically a slave your entire career barely making real money.  You are probably the religious type talking about frameworks, languages, etc.  Think about games, game consoles, automobiles, houses, etc.  If we were happy with the old stuff and never bought anything new the economy would stagnate.  In summary,  UA/UWP offers software vendors a new way to sell the same old stuff.  Join in and maybe you can buy that Tesla. 

    Broken window fallacy man. Rewriting the same bullshit over and over doesn't improve the world. This is also why I <3 open source. It's kind of like a baseline "technological commons" to build off of. You should only spend time trying to solve problems that have never been solved before, by anyone. There will always be work left to do as a software dev/computer scientist until we are living in a post-scarce society and exploring the galaxy.

  • Windows to support SSH natively

    , fanbaby wrote

    When I say win32 for nano, i mean api for server s/w, which i see no point of using over posix (linux). Win32 might be better designed (after all, it had unix as hindsight), for example CreateFile vs creat, but i'm trying to understand its value proposition.

    My guess is Microsoft will make Nano free to compete with GNU/Linux. Personally, I still wouldn't understand the value proposition. :)