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DeathByVisualStudio DeathBy​VisualStudio If we all believed in unicorns and fairies the world would be a better place.
  • The long road to the Start Screen

    @magicalclick: I think that will all depend on the application. If the metro app is designed to prompt for unsaved changes then I would think it would behave just line a desktop app. W8 does prompt you when apps are slow to shutdown when shutting down Windows like W7 does today.

    That said I do agree that the days of "you're just part of the whining minority" will be part of the marketing schtick for Microsoft. When your OS ships by default on the majority of PCs sold you can get away with stuff like that.  

  • The long road to the Start Screen

    , cbae wrote


    One can easily say:

    Joe six-pack would have had [insert issue here] by using Windows 7 but won't by using Windows 8.

    Each OS will have its own set of issues. The question is whether or not the new features/behaviors in Windows 8 solve more issues prevalent in Windows 7 rather than introducing more of its own.

    That's fair and is where we'll have to disagree on whether W7 or W8 will be better for him on the hardware he buys.

    , kettch wrote

    @DeathByVisualStudio: No he won't. Period. I support a large network of family and friends ranging from power users to drooling imbeciles, and I know with absolute certainty that none of them will have any of the problems that the so called experts are wailing about.

    Yes he will. Period. I support a large network of family and friends ranging from power users to drooling imbeciles, and I know with absolute certainty that many of them will have the problems that people are wailing about.

  • Yet another smartphone OS...

    Didn't Palm try this with WebOS already? The latter is open sourced now so why not just use it as a base? Is it poorly written? Bad end-user experience? Poor marketing? Not inverted here? HTML5 not cut out to build an OS around?

  • The long road to the Start Screen

    To those that state that Joe six-pack won't have [insert issue here] here's my equally qualified response: Yes he will have [insert issue here].

  • The long road to the Start Screen

    , cbae wrote

    @DeathByVisualStudio: Here ya go. And it will be available here for years to come.

    Ooh, I had my eye on this one.

    , spivonious wrote

    @DeathByVisualStudio: Unless I'm mistaken, Windows 8 includes downgrade rights, so yes, you can install Windows 7 on  your Windows 8 machine if you really wanted to. Frankly, I think most users will grumble about the changes for a week and then realize that the new UI is better for 90% of consumer use cases.

    But I think he meant "opt out" by not buying a new PC. 

    Neither of these options help Joe six-pack buy a laptop or desktop PC at Best Buy with Windows 7 pre-installed after the release of Windows 8. Joe six-pack in this case doesn't already own a PC but he does use one at work. So in this case he can't "opt-out" nor does he have the skills to downgrade his PC to Windows 7.

  • The long road to the Start Screen

    , cbae wrote


    You can opt-in to the features. Buying Windows 8 is opting-in. Windows 7 is for those that choose not to opt-in.

    So after W8 is released if I go into Best Buy to buy a PC I tell them I want to have the one with Windows 7 installed they'll be able to honor that just like if I went in there today and asked for the PC with Windows Vista on it?

  • The Entity Framework is now Open Source

    ++. Can't wait to see what the open source community does with this. Nice work Microsoft.

  • The long road to the Start Screen


    Windows 8 is introducing lots of new UI paradigms and is definitely a "version 1.0". It required me to think a bit differently about how to approach tasks, but now that I'm used to it, I'm much more productive. It will continue to be tweaked and I'm sure by SP1 we'll have all forgotten the little annoying bits. Windows XP was pretty bad when it first came out, but no one remembers that; they just remember the post-SP2 XP.

    I have no problem with trying something new, 1.0 and all but they didn't have to nuke (or make difficult to access) what worked well. It's like I've said all along that they are trying to force the acceptance of these new, unproven approaches on people rather than letting them opt-in and it seems kind of arrogant on their part. Hell they could even make the out-of-box experience use the 1.0 by default but let us change the default to our liking if 1.0 just doesn't cut it. Office 2013 is a great example of that. While the OOB experience is quite different than Office 2010 you can dial back the changes if you want. I'd think Microsoft would want to do that to spur adoption by business (i.e. let them deploy Windows 8 configured in the manner that they want to support it in -- start menu vs. start screen, boot to desktop -- boot to metro, etc.)

    In addition the 1.0 (all the new stuff, not just search) returns Windows to that half-baked state we've seen in just about every version of Windows prior to 7. Take the control panel/PC settings for example: some things you do in metro and others you do in the desktop. On a desktop PC that may be fine but on a tablet I don't want to try and interact with a pre-touch UX on the desktop. The reverse is true for things like devices. When I want to get to the details of my device properties half the time I'm whisked away to the devices  section of the metro PC Settings screen when what I really need is the old control panel's devices screen because you can't bring up device properties in the PC Settings screen. It's just one big hot mess.

    BTW I thought Microsoft said SPs will not longer include feature changes and additions so I'm not so sure W8 SP1 will improve on these areas unless Microsoft considers them a bug or security issue.

  • The long road to the Start Screen

    , kettch wrote

    @spivonious: No, because that would require learning something new.

    And would take more effort. Smiley

  • The long road to the Start Screen

    , Craig_Matthews wrote

    All I want is to be able to search from the desktop without obscuring everything or causing a change in context. If the start menu is gone, fine whatever, I just want to be able to search while, say, needing to reference something I'm already working on, and not being required to click several times to get to the search box in an Explorer window just to stay on the desktop.

    I bet Microsoft or someone will release a desktop gadget that provides direct search for desktop users instead of having to rely on a ninja shortcut key combo, oh wait...

    All kidding aside Start8 provides a pretty good solution.