Off topic but Chardonnay does pretty well for the Supermarkets.
I also remember the band Black Grape who were pretty good.
I think you need to be a litte bit far more specific than that. A typical line enterprise app has lookup tables and data that needs to be cached client side, winforms has far less friction, and far less code, hence cheaper, that is the trade off.kettch said:vesuvius said:*snip*
It all depends on the problems that will need to be solved. I've just never found that the sync services and datasets were as flexible as I needed. It might be fine for standalone apps, but for enterprisey stuff you might as well go with the extra flexibility that the WPF model provides.
I just did a production app in WPF just to see if I could. It didn't need to handle occaisionally connected scenarios, but I used the WPF databinding stuff. I found that even though I wrote more code, I definitely had a lot more control over the process.
What specific scerario requires that you need an additional level of control?
Do remember that the "production app" in question is a distributed application (this post), and performance is paramount. Winforms wipes the floor with WPF at present, and this is a very important facet.
I am solely answering/contributing to the problems that need to be solved by the postee, head over rather than heart.
I thought the PDC broadcasting was very very good, and it's nice to know that some of us in far away places can see the keynotes and announcements as they more or less happen.
Not quite sure what I'd ask "TheGu" or "Atters", but I will get back to this thread once I have thought of something.
I'm afraid you are very wrong there. WPF has far better databinding, but at this early stage, implementing the MVVM results in a heck of a lot of coding whereas in winforms you have your binding source and disconnected datasets so you are good to go.kettch said:Sven Groot said:*snip*
I'm a big fan of supporting a disconnected state. It lets people look at data, run reports, etc when they have connection issues or are away from the office.
A couple of projects I worked on used a SQLCE local data store and some custom rolled code to sync data and schema back and forth with the main SQL Server database. The local SQLCE queries are suprisingly fast. We even used this in an environment that needed to be pretty much realtime and we were able to sync the data fast enough that nobody notices.
Another benefit to the SQLCE route is that the desktop apps, mobile apps, and server apps all use the same schema, data layer code and business objects.
Adding a dataset you have synchronisation services build in
but the WPF programming model is not based around datasets as they are passe. Windows forms allow you to achieve MVVM without any coding because you essentially have a .NET client application with a dataset (the View Model) from a webservice without all the ceremony you have with WPF.
I have been working through the southridge demo, and you really have to do a heck of a lot of coding to achieve anything resembling a Line of business application and if I had to make the choice on a product today, winforms would be the option.
The southridge application does look good, but I would argue that it offers very little return on investment from an Office 2007 ribbon. the datagrid is more flexible, with the ability to add in whatever columm types you like, but I would use the devexpress or xceed datagrids as they have all this built in and they are far much faster that WPF.
Absolutely true., it's a case of better the devil you know, than the one you don't.JeremyJ said:Pace said:*snip*
This does sound like a pretty big project, and I'd be careful to bite off more than I can chew, so you need someone who can perform requirements analysis very well going forward.
Another thing would be to write this in Visual Basic.NET as there is bound to be far much more support for this type of migration, because writing this in C# will require someone proficient in both VB 6 and C#.
Another thing is to break this down into modules, and rather than rewrite everything, write an ASP.NET module that solves a specific business need, then move onto the next. Just the fact that this is based in different locations, means you will get multiple headaches for things being late, not working at the same time, so someone to deal with this must be designated.
To learn Sillverlight well will take you 6 months before you are sufficiently dexterous, and whether you do this in ASP.NET or Silverlight, the client will just want something that works and solves their business need
That is beyond doubt. Adding anything to IE is daunting. That said, the average user isn't too fussed with the plethora of add ons, and for the base users IE8 does not dissapoint.blowdart said:Hmm. No AdBlock. No NoScript. No way to configure how it opens tabs. The ever present favicon problem (*snicker*)
Firefox's real appeal is not in the base browser, but in the large amounts of extensions and the ease at which people can write them.
As a webdeveloper, you guys change browsers like shoes, and clearly IE is not the favorite. I really did not like IE7, but feel that things have imporoved with IE 8 (RC specifically, not the betas).
As far as tabbed browsing goes, the average user is more than catered for
I know that Firefox is an excellent browser, but you cannot tell people IE8 is total crap anymore because it isn't.
That is a lovely feature, but the main issue with it is that most icons (even modern ones like FireFox and Opera) have not been improved enough yet, so they don't look as good as something like Live Messenger that just looks gorgeous in the taskbar - even on Vista i must add.Cupiditas said:vesuvius said:*snip*
The issue I have is if you are designing an office 2007 type application on XP, you cannot use the form Chrome with system settings, or its appearance degrades drastically, so the system is getting in the way here.
If you look the way Windows is going in general, you have your core OS, and then your software as a service (SaaS) applications like Windows Live, and these applications are not tied to the operating system. At present I can use Windows Live on XP and Vista that has the Windows 7 look and feel, and your suggestion would automatically introduce an inflexibility whereby I can only use the older version on XP only or Vista only because the new one has Windows 7 system settings.
The long-and-the-short-of-it is that there is good and bad, but systems settings can become a hindrance in a lot of cases if not thought out very well from the start.
The new shell for Visual Studio is to try and depart from the same shell they were using 10 years ago, yes some people will want the classic look, but we now get to the stage where an application can never move forward because some people want it to look the way it did over a decade ago - Office 2003 is now 6 years old.
If you guys created the interfaces for HD televisions or Mobile phones your businesses would collapse. There is an understandable desire for the appearance of applications (including Visual Studio) to move with the times. The "I want my Samsung Omnia to look like the M301" argument (the first affordable mobile for the masses) will not win you new customers. Some of us are tired of grey forms and system settings.
I am using the RC of IE8 so that won't work I'm afraid.magicalclick said:You can download IEpro for spell check. It has a lot of other stuff, but myself only use spell check and the tab control. The tab control is really cool for me. All address/search you enter will result in a new tab and double click tab will close tab. I can't go back anymore.