Coffeehouse Thread

23 posts

Forum Read Only

This forum has been made read only by the site admins. No new threads or comments can be added.

Windows 8

Back to Forum: Coffeehouse
  • User profile image
    esoteric

    It looks like Windows 7 is more or less baked, so let's turn to... So let's turn to wild, blind, unsubstantiated and last but not least, wishful thinking and speculation about Windows 8...


    - OS infrastructure refactoring, ct'd
    - SQL Server infrastructure as a built-in component of the OS, deep down?
    - Transition towards WinFS vision? ("Oslo" as a key component?)
    - Repository for universal meta/data storage? (for files, for application files, application data, managed, unmanaged)
    - Windows Search uses Repository?
    - Projection of binary file metadata into the Repository? "ASN.1/M"
    - Repository as the new platform for a legacy Transactional Registry Database?
    - Transactional style everywhere? (managed, native?, "datapaint")
    - The unmanaged vs managed battle (unification) - evolution of the CLR?
    - Impact of the many-core processor paradigm, the 64 bit address space, and parallel I/O solid-state drives? (Impact on architechture, impact on CLR; well probably wohn't be that massive until Windows 9 or 10)

  • User profile image
    Bass

    - Fully open source (under an OSI approved license)

    You asked for "wishful thinking" Smiley

  • User profile image
    Dodo

    Bass said:
    - Fully open source (under an OSI approved license)

    You asked for "wishful thinking" Smiley
    That open source you refer to doesn't mean free, nor grants you any rights to the code or editing it. Open source software just means you can look at the code. A lot of people confuse that, so I'm not really sure where there's the big advantage. The performance improvements you could make to applications b knowing how the OS handles it when it's running isn't much of a deal anymore with nowadays computer systems and noone would really notice, except on a 486/586 (really slow, so to say) based system.

  • User profile image
    littleguru

    Oh c'mon... I haven't even really started beta testing and you are already on the next Windows. Tongue Out

  • User profile image
    custard55

    Well I would like to think the next version of windows will be the big move to 64 Bit... of course that means a push for 64 bit drivers and software... so many by then most manufacturers would have stepped up!

    I am saying this because PC manufactures like dell are making more and more 4GB of Ram PC's more cheaper.

  • User profile image
    Bass

    Dodo said:
    Bass said:
    *snip*
    That open source you refer to doesn't mean free, nor grants you any rights to the code or editing it. Open source software just means you can look at the code. A lot of people confuse that, so I'm not really sure where there's the big advantage. The performance improvements you could make to applications b knowing how the OS handles it when it's running isn't much of a deal anymore with nowadays computer systems and noone would really notice, except on a 486/586 (really slow, so to say) based system.
    Open source by the open source definition. And yes I'd like to look at the code and maybe modify it.

  • User profile image
    SlackmasterK

    nonono, Windows 7 is just the "Next" thing.  The "Next next" thing will be Windows 7 SP1 and Vista SP3, followed by Singularity.

  • User profile image
    Dodo

    Bass said:
    Dodo said:
    *snip*
    Open source by the open source definition. And yes I'd like to look at the code and maybe modify it.
    Open source are two words, the definition is meaningless if the words already describe the matter more clearly than the 'definition'. An open source might not be protected in a way that would prevent modification or distribution of such, but it nowhere grants you any rights to do so.

    'Open Source™' != 'open source'; //(quite ovious) Smiley

  • User profile image
    joechung

    custard55 said:
    Well I would like to think the next version of windows will be the big move to 64 Bit... of course that means a push for 64 bit drivers and software... so many by then most manufacturers would have stepped up!

    I am saying this because PC manufactures like dell are making more and more 4GB of Ram PC's more cheaper.
    They've already started.  Windows Server 2008 R2 (which also shipped yesterday, surprised that nobody mentioned it) is a 64-bit only installation, I believe.

  • User profile image
    AndyC

    joechung said:
    custard55 said:
    *snip*
    They've already started.  Windows Server 2008 R2 (which also shipped yesterday, surprised that nobody mentioned it) is a 64-bit only installation, I believe.
    Yeah, but let's  face it, nobody still buys 32-bit servers, whereas 32-bit desktops are prominent.

  • User profile image
    Bass

    Dodo said:
    Bass said:
    *snip*
    Open source are two words, the definition is meaningless if the words already describe the matter more clearly than the 'definition'. An open source might not be protected in a way that would prevent modification or distribution of such, but it nowhere grants you any rights to do so.

    'Open Source™' != 'open source'; //(quite ovious) Smiley
    Maybe, but I am talking about open source by the open source definition which indeed grants you the right to modify the source code. I clarified my first post.

  • User profile image
    esoteric

    Bass said:
    - Fully open source (under an OSI approved license)

    You asked for "wishful thinking" Smiley
    To be honest, open-source or not is not so interesting here, it's more about infrastructure, architechture, features.

  • User profile image
    Bass

    esoteric said:
    Bass said:
    *snip*
    To be honest, open-source or not is not so interesting here, it's more about infrastructure, architechture, features.
    It's interesting to me. Smiley

  • User profile image
    drummer47

    Oh, c'mon peeps. let's talk about what might go into the next version of wondows.  It seems that Microsoft were already hard at work on the next version at the time 7 was released.  Come on Microsoft, let's have some info on where you're going with this

  • User profile image
    Larry Osterman

    @drummer47:Not true.  Windows development is broken up (roughly) into 4 pieces.  The first is market research, the second is product planning, the third is development, the fourth is testing (obviously testing goes on through the development phase but the point is that no new features are written in the last piece).

    The market research stuff for Windows 8 started before Windows 7 shipped, but actual product planning didn't start until sometime after Windows 7 shipped (after all, the Windows team was busy shipping Windows - they didn't have time to do planning).

     

  • User profile image
    Larry Osterman

    @esoteric:

    - Repository for universal meta/data storage? (for files, for application files, application data, managed, unmanaged)
    - Windows Search uses Repository?

    How would such a beast help customers? 

    Remember that the Windows team no longer builds features for the sake of building features (or because the feature is "cool").  That practice ended with Alpha Longhorn.  Instead every new Windows feature needs to be directed at a particular end-user scenario.  What end-user scenario is enabled by such a universal storage system (that's not already implemented)?

    If you're going to speculate about Windows features, you should keep that in mind.  Start with the end-user scenario and go from there, don't start with a feature and say "man, that would be cool".

  • User profile image
    SlackmasterK

    I like the modularization of Windows components in Windows 7. I'd like to see this taken even further.

    There should be one edition of Windows, which comes with only the most basic components needed to make the OS run. From there, or during installation, you can select and download/install additional components based on what you want. Some of them would cost money, most of them would not. Basically you'd customize your install to the components you want. For example, how many Ultimate users actually use BitLocker?

    Further, you'd get a license for each paid component you choose to install; so you could remove that component from a computer and install it somewhere else. For example, when you sell the computer, you want to be able to say it has Windows 8; but it needs not have the $200 in add-ons you've selected.

    This framework extends to all versions of Windows including server editions. There's no technical reason I couldn't have 20 active remote desktop sessions on my plain old Windows install; only silly legal reasons.

    etc.

  • User profile image
    SlackmasterK

    My previous post was all one big idea. Now for a list of smaller ideas:

    • I'd like all services to use svchost.
    • I'd like all services, where possible, to use Delayed Start.
    • Detect and disable things that will obviously be of no use. For example, my desktop PC has no use for the Tablet PC Input service.
    • TRIM support for SSDs which are in a RAID array. Likely involves driver work, as I've only heard of one controller whose driver supports this (Intel). I don't think mine are being "TRIMed".
    • Bind WinKey-Mousewheel to Magnifier zoom. If I can do it with an AutoHotKey script, surely you can do it right into the OS. Like Apple did.
    • Easier support for installing across multiple physical disks. My main computer has 4 hard drives installed (3 volumes), and Windows exhibits odd symptoms when I try to move things to other drives. Some things are easy, like pagefiles and mydocs folders; but I see some weird side effects of placing my %TEMP% folder (for example) on my 1TB B: drive.
    • Add "Always select this option" to all dialogs that ask for a decision.
    • Stop messing with the control panel
    • Stop messing with keyboard shortcuts. Adding is fine, but don't change the ones that are already there. For example, the "Do you want to overwrite?" modal dialog that spawns from the copy/move file dialogs. XP got it right; 7 messed it up. I don't recall Vista, because it was so short-lived.
    • Take the ribbon back out of Paint and Wordpad. You messed it up, we all had a good laugh, but it's over.
    • Everything should support List view. Some of us don't like giant frackin' icons all over the place.
    • [edit/add]: Windows should be able to unload files, update them, and reload them without rebooting. At the very least, bring back "Restart Windows" without having to do a whole reboot. it's silly.
    • Better detection and handling of locked files. When I try to access a file, Windows, Search, Indexing, and everything else should try to unlock/stop using that file until I release it.
    • Paradigm shift: User input should trump 90% of everything the computer thinks it should be doing on its own. This mentality needs to permeate the product everywhere.
    • Tabbed Explorer windows
    • Two-up or Explorer views (like Stereo Shell or XTree Gold had. You remember those, right?)
    • DWM has a memory leak problem on my "heterogeneous multi-adapter configuration". I like Aero Glass, I shouldn't have to kill DWM to keep it.
    • Parts of Windows ignore my notification area icon settings. For example, "Windows has detected that your computer's performance is slow". No it's not; it's performing just fine. Stop bugging me!
    • Explorer windows should default to a size neccessary to display their contents. For example, a folder with 1,000 files needs to be larger than a folder with 1 file. However, opening such a large window for a folder with one file just wastes space.
    • When I pin an icon to the Taskband, and open multiple instances of the linked program, find a less confusing way to show them without making me count the windows to figure out which shortcut keys to press to get to the next one. For example, if Win-3 is linked to Internet Explorer, and I have 10 MSIE windows open, I have to count the different windows to find what program Win-4 will open. Surely this could be done better.
    • Stop hemming and hawing over the stuff the VIBE lab is building and start implementing them. GroupBar and Drag'n'Pop are great features to put into Windows. VIBE should also be looking into ways to integrate Kinect, and <i>multiple</i> Kinects.
    • The Explorer pane or whatever you call it needs to be "disableable". I just want a box with the folders in it; I'll navigate by the address bar, thank you very much. See also below.
    • Fix Explorer. Seriously. The below example demonstrates just how very wrong Microsoft has gotten things...

     

    What we get in Windows Explorer:

    Generic Forum Image

     

    What it actually should do:

    Generic Forum Image

    See also a short diatribe on this specific example.

Conversation locked

This conversation has been locked by the site admins. No new comments can be made.